Rocky Mountain Academy of Evergreen

Board Meeting Minutes

Page 1

Meeting Date: February 04, 2009

Meeting Location: RMAE Middle School Building - Spanish Classroom
Meeting called to order at: 07:10 PM by President John Morrill
Board members in attendance:
John Morrill (President) Bill Tomasi Ryan Lucas (non-voting)
Jeff Wilhite Nancy Fiore Jeff Robertson
Karen Hines Mike Novick (phone @ 8:30)
Seanna Mulligan

Others in attendance (from sign in sheet):

Patti Theil Marie Lynch Jessica LeBlanc
Sandra Albert Linda Nielander Jon Tesseo
Nora Flood

A Quorum is reached with those present, on the phone, and through proxies received.
Meeting notification requirements have been met.
The Pledge of Allegiance was recited by all in attendance.

Board and Public Comment:

• Patti Theil informed the Board that she commends the board for having this workshop as it is
a great step to work through the issues. She informed the board that the recent decision has
seriously impacted her PTO officers, will cause PTO to look at how the auction money is
allocated, and has impacted future PTO fund raising ability. She mentioned that a parent on
the wait list for kindergarten doubts he will get his child in to RMAE and when asked why he
responded that it was because he doesn’t know anyone on the board. Patti also informed the
Board that she is also the 5th grade coordinator and is bringing concerns from other parents
that can’t be here tonight. She wants the Board to consider the question “When is a class
full”? If the teacher says no more students, why aren’t we full. If there are only 24 seats in
art class, why aren’t we full? If there are only 24 computer terminals in technology lab, why
aren’t we full?.
• Jessica LeBlanc informed the Board that she has written a letter and gathered signatures from
teachers (she will leave a copy with the Board). Her letter outlines concerns about larger
class size and the negative impact it has on the teachers. She also states that smaller class size
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is a draw for RMAE compared to other local schools. She states that our physical classroom
sizes are too small to add desks in order to accommodate the larger class sizes so we
shouldn’t be adding any more students to classes.
• Jon Tesseo informed the Board that he understands the Boards need to accommodate
founding families, etc but reminds the Board that we have a larger responsibility to the
families and students of RMAE. Impressions are being created within the RMAE “family”
and they are not good impressions of the Board.
• Linda Neilander informed the Board that the Zementz family is not a founding family as has
been stated previously. She also stated that RMAE does not have a class cut off any more
but that when she was on the Board there used to be a class cutoff date of December 3rd but
that is no longer the case. The reason that she feels having this cutoff date is so important is
so that the parents go into open enrollment knowing how many class openings there are. She
feels that we should not accept any students past the cutoff date where we would not receive
funding for the students from JeffCo. She takes exception to the fact that there are already
24th student in the 5th grade class because the exception student is related to a part time
teacher and that the rules were setup to entice full-time teachers to our school and not aides.
She is dismayed that her child is in the affected class and states that we have grown well
beyond a start-up school and that we do not need to take more students in. She also reflected
on the fact that she heard the 5th grade teacher state to the family that he could not take
another student into the class because it is a difficult class to manage already so why did the
Board override the teacher’s wishes and put 2 more children into his class? She feels that we
are on shaky legal ground with this Board decision and stated that she has a friend who is #1
on the wait list for 3rd grade and the Board went ahead and brought in another family when
she feels that this space should have gone to this other family if we were going to expand
class sizes.
• Sandra Albert informed the Board that she has 3 kids here and that their family has been here
since the school started. She feels that the Board is walking a fine line because Evergreen
does not have bad schools and that people come to RMAE because of the class size. She also
stated that there was another new student in 8th grade this week and wanted to know why.
She stated that he has a bad reputation and we will not receive money for this student. She
feels that the RMAE reputation in the community is that we take in the troubled kids instead
of the best kids. She wants the Board to stick to the charter. She also read a comment from
Kelly Gordon: Kelly has been a parent here at RMAE since the inception, that she was
disappointed when class size became 23 and even more disappointed when it went to 24. If
the Board increases class size above and beyond the stated maximum class size, then they
better add another certified teacher and not just another aide. She feels that this decision is
reason enough to recall Board members.
• Marie Lynch informed the Board that she has 5th and 2nd grade students. She finds it
ridiculous that she even has to come here and have the conversation about why additional
students are allowed into our school when the classes are over full. She does not feel that she
should have to attend Board meetings in order to protect what she feels are her basic rights.
She also stated that she is the auction chair and feels that the funds she helps raise for RMAE
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are not going to proper use by adding an aid into the classroom instead of putting the money
towards more pressing needs like a multi-purpose building.
• Ryan Lucas informed everyone that he apologizes that an email didn’t go out to all 8th grade
families before the addition of the student in question. He did not make the decision lightly;
he coordinated with other principles in Evergreen area before making this decision. He also
informed everyone that he has additional information that he can’t share with the public but
he will share with the Board in executive session in order to better understand the complete
scenario.
o Sandra Albert stated that she heard all about this student at least one week before the
student arrived and that the “rumors preceded him”. She also stated that no student
moves to another school within a neighborhood because they are the “good” students.
She further stated that she has informed her children that unless they hear facts
directly from the new student everything else is just rumors and are not to be
believed. She does not want RMAE to become the school where others send their
“juvenile delinquents”.
o Marie Lynch stated that these are not just RMAE rumors and that she has heard from
people in the Evergreen community that do not attend our school.
o Ryan stated that he appreciated the efforts of both Sandra and Marie have made with
their children in order to squash these rumors.
• Nora Flood informed the board that she works for CLCS now, but that she was a director of a
charter school in Sonoma California. She stated to the audience that the Board contacted
CLCS immediately when this decision backfired and asked the parents to please give the
Board some credit for realizing the gravity of the issue. She stated that she has seen a change
in environment change the behavior of an 8th grade student in the past so please give the child
some time and the benefit of the doubt. She has also seen Boards get caught off guard before
because they have become complacent with their operation and didn’t realize that the school
has changed from a start-up school into a mature school. She went on to state that RMAE is
a wonderful school and that this problem is not the end of the school but rather that it is just a
learning opportunity for RMAE so please do not bail on the school and don’t bail on the
Board. She stated that this special meeting is a first step in the healing process and that she
has seen schools implode elsewhere and those schools were a lot worse off than RMAE so
she cautioned the parents not to feel that this was the beginning of the end for RMAE.
• Linda Nielander stated that when we were starting up the school we were accepting everyone
who came along because we were not full. She stated that we do not need to do this anymore.
She also stated that she feels Bergen is great school with great test scores and 24 students per
class…why should families come here anymore? She further stated that one student in the
8th grade is not going to spoil the class but how do you say “no” once you have already set
the precedent? She asked the Board if they will rescind the offer to the family who is
bringing in a kindergartener, a 3rd grade student and a 5th grade student since they have not
arrived yet? She wonders if this is an option that the Board can make a motion on this in
tonight’s meeting? She feels that the offer to the family of the student who is already in the
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5th grade should also be rescinded but that this would be cruel to the child so this is a tough
call.
o Ryan Lucas stated that this is a tough call and his advice to the Board is to not do this
because this would be a 2nd wrong and two wrongs do not make a right.
o Jon Tesseo asked if the Board has done anything that puts the charter in danger?
o Linda Nielander asked if we broke the charter by skipping the waitlist?

John Morrill stated that we do not have an answer at this point and that this is
being looked at.
o Jon Tesseo stated that he agrees with Ryan even though the decision affects his son’s
5th grade class. He stated that he is really torn about this but feels that if the Board is
not risking the school and the charter then he agrees with Ryan recommendation. If
that no longer becomes true, then he would support rescinding the offers from the
families.
o Linda Nielander stated that she agrees with Ryan for the family of the child that is
here but not for the other family since they haven’t arrived yet.
o Sandra Albert stated that she feels this is a slippery slope. Does that mean that any
parent can come in and demand that their child be accepted even if the class is full?

John Morrill stated that this is exactly what we are going to discuss in the
workshop section of tonight’s agenda and encourages everyone to stay and
participate in the discussions.
{Patti Theil, Jessica LeBlanc, Sandra Albert, and Linda Nielander leave the meeting at this point}
Consent Agenda:
• Minutes from the 01/15/09 meeting were read and approved.
Motion: John Morrill motioned to accept the 01/15/09 meeting minutes; Bill Tomasi
seconded the motion.
Discussion: none.
Vote: 5-0, approved (Seanna abstained).

Workshop Discussion:
• Wait List –
o John Morrill wants to look at the policies and procedures related to the waitlist so that
we understand why we got to this point and so that we do not get into this situation
again. Questions he feels that need to be addressed are:

Do we establish a year round waitlist?

Do we accept people onto the list year round?

What happens when an opening comes up midyear? Do we fill it with the top
of the waitlist?
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o Jeff Wilhite informed the Board that we seem to be the only charter school that does
not have a year round waitlist. He went down to the CLCS offices and performed
some research on all the other schools and they were able to pull out the waitlist for
every other school.
o Nora Flood stated that waitlists typically run from lottery to lottery. Families roll
through the list whenever there is an opening until the next lottery and then the
waitlists are thrown out and re-created.
o John Morrill wanted to make sure that everyone understood that the waitlist does not
prioritize the lottery and that it is completely separate and each family must re-apply
for the waitlist after each lottery is complete.
o Seanna Mulligan stated that she now understands why Linda Nielander mentioned
that the waitlist cutoff period was important.
o John Morrill asked what are the incremental costs associated with adding another
student to a classroom if there is an opening?
o Ryan stated that his opinion is that we should not have a formal waitlist procedure
and that the director should have decision power anytime throughout the year as long
as there is an opening in the class. Before Oct 1, he knows his budget and makes the
decision and after Oct 1 the teacher knows the class the best and he coordinates the
decision with the teachers accordingly.
o Seanna mulligan asked a question related to funding: If we are at full on Oct 1 and
then lose a student and replace a student with another student does this affect our
funding? Answer is no.
o John Morrill asked I we think we can create enough parameters around the waitlist
process so that it can be managed by the front office without a lot of oversight by the
Board and/or the Director.
o Jon Tesseo stated that when the students are allowed into RMAE and they exceed the
class size (like 3rd grade this year), they are now priority for all future years. The
Board has to look at the long term ramifications when making these types of decision.

Ryan Lucas stated that we lost 4 students between K and 1st grade last year.
We lost a total of about 10 kids between 1st grade and 5th grade total last year
so he doesn’t think that the bubble affect is going to be a problem.

Seanna Mulligan agrees with Jon Tesseo.
o Marie Lynch: Isn’t there a JeffCo wide policy around this? We can’t be the only
school struggling with this.

John Morrill: There is and that is why we are having this discussion tonight.
Some schools take the waitlist yearlong and others cut off at various dates.

Nora Flood: Each school is different. This boils down to what is the Boards
responsibility and what is the administrator responsibility? This leads into the
discussions of what type of Board you have here at RMAE and what kind you
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are growing into. You will need to go through the Policy book and evaluate
each policy and see if it still fits your needs.
o Nora Flood stated that in the charter renewal document she has, the BOD struck the
comment that RMAE would be using our own enrollment policy so RMAE must use
the JeffCo policy.

Ryan stated that he doesn’t know where this was stricken because in his
version it is not marked as stricken. Discussions ensued around which copy is
the most recent and most accurate.

Nora stated that Bylaws trump policies.
o Jon Tesseo stated that he believes that if you accepted families who were not on the
waitlist and jumped the families that are on the waitlist then RMAE is in violation.

Ryan Lucas stated that we don’t have a year round waitlist that we have to
follow. The prioritized waitlist is only in effect until Oct 1st per JeffCo Policy
and then we create a non-prioritized list of interested families. He further
stated that we do not actively call the families on the list should an opening
occur and that they have to call in to us in order to see if there is an opening.
o Ryan re-iterated that he would recommend that we follow JeffCo policy through Oct
1st.
o Jon Tesseo stated that the only issue he sees in this is that if we accept a student after
the cut off period, it affects the ability for the first families on the wait list to get into
the school the following year.
{Mike Novick joined via conference phone}
o Jeff Wilhite asked the question: If you fill a slot and the family has siblings they go
to the top of the list. Is this what causes the confusion?

Ryan Lucas answered Yes. The waitlist is not set in stone and if a student
gets into a class that has openings and has siblings, the siblings get bumped up
on the list for their respective classes. This is per JeffCo policy.
o JonTesseo asked a hypothetical question: If an opening comes up and a family
decides not to take the opening because it is mid-year and they don’t want to take it,
you give it to someone else, it could adversely affects the family’s chances next year.

Bill Tomasi stated that this is ok because the family has consciously decided
not to take the opening and knows they are not guaranteed to have another
opening next year.
o Ryan Lucas re-iterated that this has to be based on directors prerogative.
o Nora Flood stated that she will get us waitlist / enrollment language from other JeffCo
schools.
o Seanna Mulligan indicated that if the Board is becoming a Governance Board, then
that means we need to dictate policy and pass this off to someone who can manage it.
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o Ryan Lucas stated that by putting in place a firm waitlist, this is what could very well
make us a dumping ground for every other school and that he heard the parents earlier
loud and clear that this is not what they want.

Bill Tomasi agreed that this is not what we want. We need to be able to
choose families that are good fit for RMAE and where RMAE is a good fit for
the student.
o Ryan Lucas stated (again) that we have to have flexibility. He reiterated his opinion
that this should always be at the discretion of the director as he described above.

Mike Novick wanted to know what policies does Ryan use? We do not want
to get our school into a legal problem. For transfers within JeffCo, we are
covered by a JeffCo policy but the issue comes in when we are talking about
out of JeffCo transfers.
o John Morrill asked what are the pros and cons of a waitlist and/or an interest list?
Can we put a framework around this in order to handle 80%+ of the situations?
o Ryan Lucas stated that there is a policy within JeffCo schools and information on the
students are shared via Infinite Campus and went into an example of the type of
conversation he would have with a family in order to dissuade the student from
coming into RMAE due to disciplinary issues. However, he would be willing to
accept a policy that states we will not accept any students after our cutoff date from
outside JeffCo because he wouldn’t have any information about these students.
o POLICY CONCEPT:

For classes that have vacancies:
• Before Oct 1, we follow JeffCo policy regarding the lottery and
prioritized wait list.
• After Oct 1 for transfers within JeffCo, the Director can make the
decision based on disciplinary information that is shared between the
schools, what is in the best interest of RMAE, and what the teacher
feels he / she can handle in the classroom.
• After Oct 1 for transfers outside of JeffCo, our new policy is that we
will not accept any students.

For classes at 23 (or 24):
• No acceptance of additional students.
o Legal questions arose about what we are allowed to eliminate families for without
creating the illusion of discrimination.

Nora is going to get us draft language ASAP on this so that we can make an
informed decision.
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2 Board members (Bill and Seanna) are going to talk to our legal counsel
Barry Arrington regarding this and the previous decision that was made and
find out our legal options.
{Jon Tesseo and Marie Lynch leave the meeting at this point}

Executive Session:
Motion: John Morrill motioned to go into executive session pursuant to C.R.S. section 24-6-
402(4)(a); Jeff Robertson seconded the motion.
Discussion: None.
Vote: 7-0, approved (no one abstained).

• Pursuant to section 24-6-402(4)(a), the Board is going into executive session at 9:22pm for
the discussion of the purchase, acquisition, lease, transfer, or sale of any real, person, or other
property interest. The Board has invited Nora Flood in to the executive session.

Motion: John Morrill motioned to come out of executive session at 09:52 PM; Jeff
Robertson seconded the motion.
Discussion: None.
Vote: 7-0, approved (no one abstained).

Motion: Ryan motioned that 2 Board members meet with Barry Arrington to discuss this
issue and authorizes them to reduce the amount DB owes RMAE on the sale of the first lot an
amount not to exceed $3,000 and to defer the deducted amount over the remaining lots in
reference to the recommendation of legal counsel per the existing agreement dated 10-27-05;
Jeff Robertson seconded the motion.
Discussion: None.
Vote: 6-0, approved (Jeff Wilhite abstained).

Motion: John Morrill motioned to go into executive session pursuant to C.R.S. section 24-6-
402(4)(h); Jeff Robertson seconded the motion.
Discussion: None.
Vote: 7-0, approved (no one abstained).

• Pursuant to section 24-6-402(4)(h), the Board is going into executive session at 9:57pm for
the discussion of individual students where the public disclosure would adversely affect the
student. The Board has invited Nora Flood in to the executive session.

Motion: John Morrill motioned to come out of executive session at 10:09 PM; Bill Tomasi
seconded the motion.
Discussion: None.
Vote: 7-0, approved (no one abstained).
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Motion: John Morrill motioned to go into executive session pursuant to C.R.S. section 24-6-
402(4)(f); Jeff Robertson seconded the motion.
Discussion: None.
Vote: 7-0, approved (no one abstained).

• Pursuant to section 24-6-402(4)(f), the Board is going into executive session at 10:14pm for
the discussion of personnel matters, unless the employee asks for an open meeting. The
Board has invited Nora Flood in to the executive session.

Motion: John Morrill motioned to come out of executive session at 10:23 PM; Bill Tomasi
seconded the motion.
Discussion: None.
Vote: 7-0, approved (no one abstained).

Action Items to be Completed Before Next Board Meeting -

• Board members are to read and understand the Charter School Renewal Contract that Ryan
handed out. Ryan requests that each Board member email him with questions by this Friday.

Board and Public Comment:

• Ryan Lucas informed the Board that he is working with Dina to run the numbers and see if
we can physically add both 4th and 5th grade classes next year. The benefit of this approach is
that we would stabilize the RMAE environment in one step and get over the growing pain in
one year. He had Rosanne discuss this option with some of the families on the interest list
and see how they would respond to this opportunity and 9 of them indicated that they would
be a “10” on a scale of one to ten. Ryan emphasized that nothing has been decided and that
this is all exploratory but that he would like to this as a discussion item on the next Board
meeting agenda.

Next board meeting scheduled for: February 12th, 20098 at: 6:30 pm

With no further business, this meeting was adjourned at: 10:35 PM

Motion: Ryan Lucas moved to adjourn the meeting; Karen Hines seconded the motion.
Discussions: None.
Vote: 7-0, approved (No one abstained)

Respectfully submitted
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William Tomasi
Secretary