New Model Armys Justin Sullivan

STILL BURNING

Photo: Michael Sanderson

 Photo: Michael Sanderson
The reluctant family patriarch
A revitalized band backed by an almost religiously
devoted family that follow them from country to country.
A band followed by an almost ritualistic collective focused
on the love of music, leftish consensus and the strongest
sense of community available. And a band that acts as
a unifying factor for people from all corners of the world.
But one thing that New Model Army isnt, and that theyve
never been, is a political band. Instead, its all been about
music and fellowship, and thats whats kept the fire in-
tensely burning for almost 40 years.

It might be hard to believe, but
its been almost exactly 37 years to
the day since New Model Army
played their first live show. Nigh
on four decades filled to the brim
with lyrical rage, political as well as
everyday observations and a strong
love of nature in all its greatness
and mystery. And all the while, the
band has constantly kept on mov-
ing, from the early days as a pure-
bred indie band, via the EMI big
label success during the 90s, and
a more searching 00s to todays
DIY indie comforts.
Ignored by the trendsetters
New Model Army saw the light
of day in Bradford in 1980, and
quickly went on to become a
household name in the post punk
and alternative circles of Thatchers
Englands much thanks to the
bands uncompromising attitude
and intense live performances.
Mostly ignored by the media,
and constantly slandered by the
trend-sensitive English music press,
they saw to creating their own
niche, a niche that quickly attract-
ed a hoard of unusually devoted
fans, fans that in the band found
someone who lent voice to the
vagabonds, the ones left on the
outside. All set to a soundtrack
that displayed a truly patented and
unique blend of beautiful melodies
and uncompromising energy.
The interest in the band may have
had its ups and downs, sometimes
perhaps leaving New Model Army
as a concern only to the most loyal,
the truest of believers. No matter
where in the world they were. Be-
cause the bands fan base dubbed
The Family can be found
almost anywhere, in any and all
countries. Through letters, message
boards and Facebook groups, the
fans kept on, and keep on, express-
ing their love, staying in touch, and
making travelling arrangements for
the next show. No matter where
in the world their devotion takes
them.
More relevant than ever
The energy, it seems, has never
waned; the fervor has been a con-
stant for 37 years. 37 years of ups
and downs, of life and death, thick
and thin, and lost friends. Its also
meant 37 years of incessant travels
through different genres that has
seen the band move from the in-
tense post punk of the 80s, through
beautiful folky rock and broader
rock efforts spiced with bona fide
metal guitar riffing, to 2013 years
revitalization with Between Dog
and Wolf and the presents mix of
everything and nothing. Constant-
ly moving, constantly reinventing
themselves and their history.
The history as well as the journey
ahead was last showcased on the
bands fourteenth album, Winter,
released on their own label just
over a year ago. An album filled to
the brim with an almost perfect
blend of beautiful poetry, everyday
observations, anguished roars of
defiance, angry guitars, and beauti-
ful melodies. A logical continuance,
yet another chapter in the New
Model Army story. Once again, a
rejuvenated band, more relevant
than ever, angrier at the world than
ever before.
The need to tell the stories
And so, in late august 2017, al-
most 37 years to the day after that
first live show, we meet up with a
relaxed Justin Sullivan, the bands
founder, singer and main writer,
comfortably vaping and playing
his guitar, in the sunny bailey of
a Welsh castle. The graying hair is
held back by a pair of sunglasses,
but otherwise the look is the same
as what weve gotten used to these
last ten years: jeans, long sleeved
t-shirt and a ready smile where
one front tooth glitters with gold.
Everything, in other words, is as it
should. All is normal in New Mod-
el Army country a country that
consists of manically devoted fans,
one of the musical worlds strongest
senses of belonging, and Justins
intense need to tell us stories about
life, love, and the injustices of the
world.
So, almost 40 years ? And still
nothing seems to have changed.
The world with its divisions,
injustices and wrongdoings that
Photo: Michael Sanderson
Justin addressed in 1983 on the
bands first single, Bittersweet re-
mains unchanged and everythings
still the same.
Its staring straight between the eyes
Something isnt right
The harder we try
the more we realise
Something isnt right
So bittersweet, this whole thing,
so bittersweet
(Bittersweet, 1983)
How difficult is it really,
nowadays, to hold off from
writing the same things over
and over again? I mean, many
of your darker lyrics from the
Thatcher 80s are scarily rele-
vant today do you ever feel
that youre repeating yourself?
Obviously, thats something Im
more than aware of, and its certain-
ly a challenge to describe and write
about the world around us when
theres so much crap that just keeps
on going, that remains the same.
So yeah, its harder today and I find
myself wrestling with the feeling of
done that, written that. However,
there are always new topics and
new angles that keep on appearing
to me.
Case in point on the latest
Sweden tour, you played Die
Trying from Winter that
deals with the refugee crisis
and the misery related to it,
but on a few shows you chose
to replace it with Higher
Wall from 1987, which is ba-
sically the same song, with an
identical message. Isnt that an
example of exactly that?
Yes, you might say that. Die
Trying was actually a song I tried
really hard not to write, because as
you said, Id already written it. But
I just couldnt stay away. My girl-
friend lives in Paris, and so I often
drive past the refugee camp, the
one that used to be in Calais, which
is now being built up, torn down
and then rebuilt in a thoroughly
miserable way. And after seeing
that, it became impossible not to
write it, the words just came to me
and the song wrote itself in five
minutes.
With the migrant crisis, the
widening economic gaps and
general dissatisfaction filling that only gets bigger and bigger.
the front pages has anything And then we had the financial
really happened, whats really collapse in 2008 and everything
been going on since the 80s was made clear. Everyone could
when you started out? see how the system worked, how
Well, first of all, I do think things completely corrupt and wrong it
are changing. Quite a lot, actually. really was. There is no free market,
Unfortunately, not necessarily for its all rigged. And in the light of
the better. If you look at how it was that, there was potential for change,
in the early 80s with its fana- there could have been change, but
tical individualism and the almost nothing happened. My friend Toby,
religious trust in the market, where who grew up in East Germany,
everything human, all human activ- compared it to what it was like
ity was aligned with the market and there when he was younger: Ev-
everything was for sale, that was eryone knows the system is fucked,
something that just kept on going, but nobody knows how to fix it.
that just increased throughout So, people kept on pretending.
the 80s. And for a while there, it
looked as if the system could deliver And now weve arrived at a point
on its promises, for some people. where all of those for whom the
system isnt working, are starting
But not for everyone? to protest, for real. It may manifest
No, not at all. But enough to itself in the growth of both the
keep the system alive, right into traditional and the radical left, or in
the 21st century when it became the increasing fascism and right-
increasingly clear that its all is built wing that we see everywhere in the
on lies and injustices that are truly western world. And the mistake
disastrous for people, and on a scale people make, and keep on making,
Photo: Fredrik van der Lee
is to believe that people want to
keep the status quo in the middle,
with the market liberalists, when
the truth is that we vote for them
only to keep the extremists out. As
in the case with Macron in France.
Or, earlier, Blair in England.
So, whats your take on the
situation on England today?
Well, in England, the situations
even more of a mess. Im not a
Corbyn supporter, but of course
Ill vote Labor, if nothing else to
protest all the years of crap from
the Tory bastards. When it comes
to Brexit, Im all for remaining, I
think its utter madness to leave.
And of course, Ill state that opin-
ion to anyone who asks, but hope-
fully without judging or shouting it
to people who wont listen.
So, what can you do as an art-
ist? What can New Model Army
do to make our world a better
place?
Haha, nothing! Were just musi-
cians, were just a band.
Well, thats not really true, is
it? You do have an extremely
important role to play for the
fans. Fans who are close to reli-
giously devoted and who listen
to what you say, the messages
you communicate?
Thats really hard to answer, in all
honesty. I would actually never try
to force my views on anyone. And
in light of that, its important to
state that politics is just one out of
the many topics that I write about,
and that New Model Amy isnt
and never has been a politi-
cal band. Thats quite a common
mistake that people make, thinking
that were driven by some kind of
political agenda. The thing that
drives us, and thats always been our
main interest, is the music.
But can you understand why
people would think that?
The concerts have
become more and
more charged.
Its something that we
feel very clearly,
on stage
Yeah, maybe, to some extent, if
you look at it superficially. I like
to write about whats happening in
the world around me, but if you
take a look at the rest of the band,
no ones very politically involved.
If pushed, I guess well all define
ourselves as left wing to some ex-
tent, but were all, always, primarily
musicians, rather than guitar-play-
ing activists. I, personally, may be
a bit more involved, and I always
have been, but thats just me, and
nothing that stands for New Model
Army as a band.
Yes, in my book New Model
Armys never been a left wing
band, and youve always gone
beyond political demagogy,
dealing with things in a much
broader sense. More human-
ism than placard politics,
perhaps?
Yes, that sounds about right.
And one part of that comes from
my interest in writing songs from
different perspectives than my own;
perspectives that you may not even
agree with. Songs like One of the
Chosen that tells about how it feels
to be a religious fundamentalist, or
My People Right or Wrong, writ-
ten during the Balkan crisis, which
takes place in the head of a sectari-
an nationalist. Its a bit like writing
a novel, you need to understand all
the characters, the roles they play
and the things that drive them. If
you only have one main character,
and one perspective, therell only
be enough material for one record,
and then youre done.
So, back to the relationship
with the fans dont you think
that a role you can play then is
to provide some sort of solace
or meaning, some kind of polit-
ical consensus or unity?
Maybe. Todays situation, the
result of the internet-based world,
and the reduction of all humans
to consumers and isolated entities,
seems to have created a stronger
need for community and together-
ness, and its becoming increasingly
important. Its become evident for
us when we play live. Ive noticed
these last couple of years that the
sense, the need of coming togeth-
er has become even more intense.
Theres a sense of energy of an
almost tribal nature, and the con-
certs have become more and more
charged. Its something that we feel
very clearly, on stage.
I guess that is the case, in
times of insecurity and frag-
mentation people start
looking for like-minded and
turn more to groups or clans.
But what is it that makes New
Model Army fans so loyal, so
passionate and banded togeth-
er?
I think a large part stems from the
old fact that we never were me-
dia darlings, that we always were
treated kind of bad by the press in
the past. That made people become
a bit possessive, seeing us as their
band, that only they could under-
stand or love. Another part, I think
is based around the music. Ive been
told that it has a certain kind of
flavor that I think appeals to a cer-

tain kind of listener. A flavor that
they obviously cant find anywhere
else.
I think it was Joolz that wrote
in a Family manifesto of sorts,
that the base of The Family
always has been the emotional
response to the emotions in
the music. Isnt that the very
definition of tribal and a uni-
fying ritual?
Thats absolutely right. In a sense.
However, I feel its important to
make it clear that weve never
promised our fans anything, more
than to always be ourselves and be
true to who we are. Weve never
wanted to be leaders or anything,
with the responsibilities that come
with that. So here we are today, ba-
sically doing the same things weve
always done, since the very begin-
ning playing music that we like.
Obviously, its flattering to know
that were such an important part
in many peoples lives, but that has
never meant the weve felt the need
to adapt, change or try to meet any
demands or requirements from the
people who follow us.
So, how do you feel about The
Family?
Well, our fans and our audience
are all individuals. I always feel
that the whole collective thing is
a bit odd. Other artists talk to me
about the audience as if it was one
entity. Ultimately, its a gathering
of individuals, with their own lives,
views, needs and wants. Using the
Brexit thing as an example, I am as
I said, a firm remainer. But I know
that among our fans there are going
to be people who voted to leave.
Do I think they are scum of the
earth and racist pigs? Of course not.
I think theyre wrong, but Id never
exclude them or treat them differ-
ently. Basically, its the same as with
the band, its a unity of differences
in minds, opinions and ways to
look at things. The members of
New Model Army, just like the
Photo: Michael Sanderson
fans, may represent a unity and a
joint cause, but in the end, were all
separate, with different values. You
have to accept each other for the
things you have in common and try
to get along.
And if I say that the world
would be a much better place if
everyone just listened to New
Model Army?
Id say that it wouldnt be hard for
you to find people whod disagree.
But I might have to agree, if noth-
ing else out of a sense
of personal vanity.
Interview:
Fredrik van der Lee