Porosity in 6061-T6 aluminum butt welds(no purge) https://app.aws.org/forum/topic_show.pl?

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Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Porosity in 6061-T6 aluminum butt welds(no purge)

By Kix Date 04-29-2008 12:22

Why do you get sub surface porosity when doing an aluminum butt weld on plate or pipe.  I've ran into to this now
doing 1/8"plate single pass full pen butt welds and pipe butt welds (no purge).  On the multipass pipe welds the
porosity is only in the root and does not come into the fill passes. These coupons have been with 6061-T6, ER4043
and ER4643 filler both times, butted straight up (no gap).  When you do purge, there is no porosity.  Thoughts and
opinions welcome.;-)

By Lawrence Date 04-29-2008 12:43 Edited 04-29-2008 12:45

In all my years I have never purged full pen aluminum groove welds so I can't hazard a guess on that one..

Maybe Al can?

I think you are prolly aware of this stuff already but I'll chime in just a bit anyhow.

Poroisty in aluminum is usually limited to very small hydrogen bubbles (aluminum has an affinity for Hy when molten). When the
weld pool cools and freezes the hydrogen is expelled. If not all the Hy is expelled the extra is noted as porosity and can often be
seen a grainy appearence on the surface of the weld, especially at weld terminations.  That *Extra* hydrogen can be absorbed in
several ways.

Aluminum oxide while as hard a diamonds is also porous like a sponge... Moisture can be trapped within this oxide matrix and the
moisture will disassociate when it comes into the arc plasma into Oxygen and Hy, with the Hy being absorbed into the weld. This
makes oxide removal at the time of surface prep important... Inside, outside and on the faying surface no matter how thin the
aluminum.

If the aluminum was formerly annodized, some of the new stuff must be literally scraped off with a machine tool, the abrasives
that usually work quite well may smear and leave just enough of the anodized coating to foul the weld.

Lastly but often the most common reason is overheating the part.  A slow manual weld or too small filler wire may cause
excessive heat build up which can bring Hy back into play even with very good surface prep. This is more common with thinner
aluminum or at weld terminations when the heat cannot be conducted away.  Faster travel speed, larger filler diameter to cool the
puddle and heat sinks can sometimes help this situation.

Also take a close look at those 1/8 inch faying surfaces.. If the shear  or cutting tool has left a rough surface it will hold all kinds of
bad stuff that will foul a weld... 1/8 is about as thick as you can go with a square groove weld and GTAW with aluminum and a
single pass.  I also think with 0.125 thickness that you may be better served with at least a small root opening if design allows for
it, this will reduce the amount of current it takes to make the weld overall.  Try 3/32 or 1/8 filler to help cool the puddle as you
go.  Even a 1/16 root opening will reduce the current requirement considerably on this joint.  If it were 0.090 or less I would say
but em flush.

By Kix Date 04-29-2008 14:35

I talked to one of my Miller buddies that used to be with the Syncowaves and the Aerowaves about this little ordeal. 
He told me that a lot of aerospace companies were having probs with porosity in their roots.  They said they found
that the machines where you can adjust the frequency were the ones that seamed to be having the problems. 
Everyone was running the frequency up pretty high in the 150 to 180 range and around a 70% balance.  This cooled
the puddle just quick enough not to allow all the Hy out of the puddle.  When running lower freq and and a smaller
percentage of balance they were able to cure the problem.
     I'll admit on this last pipe coupon we ran the freq up around 150 and the balance was 70%, but in my previous experiences I've
had this problem with your standard 60Hz machines.  The only way we got rid of the porosity was by purging.  The tests were
done in a enviromentally controlled room with all the proper cleaning procedures.  Rods were also controlled.  Keep in mind that
this porosity is small and even if you ground into the weld you would not find it because of it smearing the pockets over.  X-ray
and tensile pulls are the only way I've been able to see this.

By Lawrence Date 04-29-2008 15:51 Edited 04-29-2008 16:10

Ray

Forget about the frequency... That has nothing to do with it...... The higher the Freq. the better the arc will stay at the tip of the
electrode and the more columner the arc will be.

Balence control may very well be your bug-a boo..... 

That 70% EN balence on your inverter provides less cleaning action than a traditional square wave power supply like Synchrowave
or Percision Tig when they are set at Max Pen...

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That high dollar inverter and its balence controls are rarely an advantage on X-ray quality welds... You will find that the best X-ray
quality AC aluminum GTAW performance will be in parameters that a transformer rectifier traditional square wave power supply
delivers.

This is a big stumbling block.. and here is the key:

Traditional Square Wave (synchrowave)  vs  True Square wave (Dynasty & Aerowave)

Balence control on Traditional Squaare wave is Max 68% EN 

VS

Balence control on a True Square wave  Up to 99% EN

This means when you set your balence at 7 of 10 on a traditional square wave you will be getting about 57% dwell time
on EN  as compared to a True Square wave set to 7 out of 10 that will produce 70% EN

Anything over 70% EN is going to require special surface oxide removal preparation or simply may not work when Xray quality is
required.

Back off 55 or 60% EN on your Balence and I bet results are going to make you happy.

The special effects produced by True Squarewave are nice to make small profile fillets and grooves... But if that is not a
requirement I think you should stay under that 68% EN balence..

Frequency adjustment up to 200 Hz will help keep the arc at the tip of your electrode as you tail off and decrease the current at
weld termiations and on thinner aluminum

By Kix Date 04-29-2008 16:00

I understand what you are saying totally and that was very informative info about the traditional square wave and the
true squarewave that I didn't know.  However, my 1/8" square butt full penn welds were done with a syncrowave and a
60-65% balance and I still got the same porosity.  I'm up in the air on this one.

By Lawrence Date 04-29-2008 16:14

Were both sides prepped and the root faces?

By Kix Date 04-29-2008 16:33

That's affirmative on that one boss.;-)

By Lawrence Date 04-29-2008 17:43 Edited 04-29-2008 17:48

Ok Ray

Let me ask this...

I'm assuming D1.2 and looking at 5.15.1.3 which seems pretty liberal about RT poroisity. Are your pore deminsions truly larger
than 1/32" ? 

Or are you qualifying via 5.15.2 for Cyclically loaded non tubular connections even though your joining pipe?

Tell us more about the quality and quantity of discontinuities/porosity.

Are they small pores in a tight line?

Or are they spread out through the width of the melt?
Are they only at starts and terminations?

By Kix Date 04-29-2008 18:20

We're qualifying to D1.2(2003) and RT is not needed.  This porosity does however affect the bend straps.  I thought it
might of been a failure in the heat affected zone, but after etching I found the defect was in the weld which leads me
to believe it opened up because of all the porosity.  This porosity is way smaller than 1/32" and it is spread throughout
the width and length of the root in both my cases.  The 1/8" plates I did a long time ago were for aerospace
applications so they had to be shot.  This pipe is being subjected to D1.2(2003) criteria so no RT.

By Lawrence Date 04-29-2008 18:37

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Did the as welded surface of these failed welds look bumpy or grainy under magnification?

By Kix Date 04-29-2008 18:56

Negative, they had real nice ripple definition and raised no flags on the front side surface or the inside of the pipe.  I
wish I had a camera that took good pictures.  I'm going to go dig for a camera and see what kind of pics I can take.

By bozaktwo1 Date 04-29-2008 17:03

Just to emphasize some of what Lawrence is telling you, clean everything down to sound metal.  I recently qualified procedures
for 6061-T6 square tube Class II structure, and one of the first things I found is that a CJP without backing gas will produce
porosity and other undesirable side effects.  The largest contributor is contamination in the root faces and just inside the backside
of the root.  The first thing I do is to grab my (clean) files and take that edge off until the saw marks are gone, and file the inside
edge back at least 1/8".  Then I use a sander to put my bevel in, then file that.  Then a manual stainless steel wire brushing, then
MEK and up in the jig.  I tack it together, take it down and clean it all over again; and wire brush the crud out of the groove before
laying in my next pass.  It seems to have helped a lot, and now I'm qualifying GMAW procedures for the same application but PJP
(shooting for 90%).  Whole different set of problems, but I think my prep and clean is down pat. 

Good luck.

By mechan Date 04-29-2008 18:33

I'm curious as to why you would use a 'sander', aren't you concerned with impregnating the parent metal? I've always had the
best luck when doing aluminum joints that were going to be shot just using a new file and new stainless wire brush, apparently
dipping them is suppose to work well as well. Maybe I missed this, but why would you not be using a backing gas on your weld?

By bozaktwo1 Date 04-30-2008 16:35

Any possible impregnation/inclusion from the sander is removed with the file.  I have a very high success rate with this method.

By 522029 Date 04-29-2008 20:49

There was an article in   Practical Welding   in just the last couple of months saying that porosity in aluminum welds is hydrogen,
always.
Now the kicker is what is causing the hydrogen and what to do to correct it.

I think the author's name was  Frank Armao  if anyone wants to search for the article.

Griff

By 803056 Date 04-29-2008 21:06 Edited 04-29-2008 21:08

I thought I was reading an old post where the question was nearly identical.

Cleaning is the problem.

You don't need a root opening and you don't need a gas purge on the root side.

Porosity is most often associated with incomplete cleaning. That includes the base metal, the filler metal, and it means the welder
has to wear gloves so as not to recontaminate anything he or she touches.

If the porosity is discolored, the problem is most likely associated with incomplete shielding. However, if the porosity is silver on
the inside, hydrogen is the culprit. Other than cleaning, the source of the problem is the welder or material handlers touching the
parts with their bare hands or touching and handling the filler metal with dirty gloves or bare hands.

I once had a welder that couldn't pass his welder qualification test. He failed it several times before he came to me for help. I
watched him make one weld and immediately saw the problem. He would tack the plates at one end, hold the FM between his
lips while he tapped the plates together before making the second tack weld on the opposite end. When I brought it to his
attention he told me I was crazy, he knew better than to do that. So I had him set up again and stopped him as he put the FM
between his lips.

Talk about embarrassing moments!

I knew this subject sounded familiar. Look under Qualification and Certification: AWS D17.1 Aluminum cert ( class A)

Best regards - Al

By bozaktwo1 Date 04-30-2008 16:37

You bet, if the metal's not clean you're done for.  However, D1.2 allows some porosity, and there's a good reason for this. 

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Humidity in the air will contribute to the occurrence of porosity on the backside.

By Kix Date 04-30-2008 16:46 Edited 04-30-2008 17:11

Here are the pics I took.  You can see some of the shiny porosity and the dark spots are also shiny porosity, but the
light doesn't show it.  Some of the porosity is slightly bigger than a pin head.

Picture of some of the root and what it looked like after a good power brushing.- http://i11.photobucket.com/albums
/a189/vdubin474/ALroot-pic.jpg
8'' sched 80 pipe tensile-http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/vdubin474/8sched80porosity.jpg
both of them together-http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/vdubin474/8sched80porosity3.jpg
another shot-http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/vdubin474/8sched80porosity2.jpg
fracture in HAZ-http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/vdubin474/8sched80fullpic3.jpg
fracture in weld starting due to porosity in the root-http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/vdubin474/8sched80fullpic2.jpg
3"sched 40 pipe tensiles-http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/vdubin474/3sched40porosity.jpg
another-http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/vdubin474/3sched40porosity3.jpg
another-http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/vdubin474/3sched40porosity2.jpg
last, but not least-http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a189/vdubin474/3sched40pic.jpg

By Kix Date 04-30-2008 12:32

Hydrogen is definetly the culprit here and I will be posting pictures here in a bit.  I have to take the camera down to
another guys office and have the pictures put on his PC so he can e-mail them to me.  Then I will post them up and
you guys can see what I'm talking about.  Al, I will search for that thread you posted and see what it has to offer.

By 803056 Date 04-30-2008 21:33

You didn't mention whether these tensile tests passed the minimum tesile strength requirements.

What's up with that? Or, did I miss somethng?

Best regards - Al

By Kix Date 04-30-2008 23:33

Yes, the tensiles passed and the whole 8" sched 80 pipe PQR was good.  The 3" sched 40 PQR failed due to a bend
strap fracture in the weld because of the porosity.  How does one go about losing that porosity? Yes, the coupons
were really clean.

By 803056 Date 05-01-2008 22:13 Edited 05-01-2008 22:15

The fact that the 8 inch pipe passed is evidence it can be done.

The porosity in the 3 inch is related to cleaning or if you are utilizing a root opening, insufficient gas shielding of the root side due
to the possibility of turbulence and the aspiration of air into the weld puddle.

If you are using a root opening, eliminate it. There are two approaches that can be taken. Utilize a zero root opening and a small
root face, about 1/16 inch, with a 70 to 80 degree groove angle. The other is to use a U-groove with a small root face. With a
U-groove you should be able to use a 3/32 inch root face and obtain complete joint penetration.

Best regards - Al 

By Kix Date 05-02-2008 13:03

Al,
  I feel that the 8" pipe passed because we did side bends and got lucky.  The 8" would of opened up like the 3" if it
was bent in the same way.  The joint of these two procedures follows Figure 3.30 for tubular groove welds in 
D1.2(2003)and has no gap.  I would never run a gap on a aluminum full penn weld because the penn you end up with
is not as good as when you have a tight butt.  So if the metal was not cleaned properly would I still get hydrogen
porosity?  Well, here is a little run down of our cleaning procedure.  The coupons are machined to get rid of the high low and the
groove type put on, then they get stainless steel wire hand brushed, then we use ARCAIR Protex ALLclean aluminum cleaner with
a good scrub,  that gets washed off with alcohol and dried, then we tack up and weld. 
     Do you think if some of the acid residue was not all the way cleaned off it would cause my problem?  I'm just curious as to why
this happens because like I said before this isn't the first time I've seen this.  The last time I saw it I know for sure it wasn't because
I had a gap (because I never use one) or lack of cleaning and we never found out what caused it.  Maybe it's acid residue, or
maybe the pipe had condensate on it while it was coming up to temp.  I didn't see any while our guys was putting the root in, but
ya never know.  Maybe I'll take the chill out of the coupon this time just as a precautionary measure. Al, I appreciate all the help
you've been giving and I will get to the bottom of this. I hope.;-)

By 803056 Date 05-02-2008 15:24

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Chemical cleaning must be controlled. The concentration of the cleaning solution and the time as well as final flushing to remove
the cleaning solution are very important.

Etching can be sever if the time isn't controlled. Contamination can be worse after cleaning if the time isn't controlled or if the
final cleaning is incomplete.

You said you use an acid solution. Acid is a hydrogen ion rich environment, so unless the acid is completely neutralized, you can
have problems.

I recently had a problem with delayed hydrogen  cracking in the HAZ on a project that was (in my opinion) due to the acid
pickling performed before the hot dip galvanizing operation.

Chemical cleaning is fast and efficient, but it has to be controlled, controlled, controlled. Even then, nothing beats hand brushing
and draw filing just prior to assemble and welding.

Best regards - Al

By DaveBoyer Date 05-03-2008 03:57

While acids disolve oxides, acid fumes cause surfaces to oxidize. The preperation methods need to rinse off the acid but not
expose the cleaned surfaces to acid fumes.

Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Porosity in 6061-T6 aluminum butt welds(no purge)

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