Documente Academic
Documente Profesional
Documente Cultură
02-04-2011
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Preface
Hopefully it will offer at least one new insight that will inspire the
faith.
Dialogue One
Pilgrim: You’ve been identified with many names over the course of history, is there one
Lucifer: Well, the name given to me by the One would be a good choice.
Lucifer: Lucifer.
Pilgrim: It seems a little ironic that you, as the One’s most dedicated enemy, would make
Lucifer: Not really. I used to be the One’s “right hand man” so to speak. “Lucifer” means
Lucifer: Exactly. I mean how complimentary are Prince of Darkness, Satan, Beelzebub,
Father of Lies, etc. They’re all true, but they don’t have the dignity. Although “Prince of
Pilgrim: I guess the “Prince” part does. But you also mentioned “Father of Lies.”
Lucifer: Yes and no. I tell a great deal of truth too. It’s just that I use truth as a tool in
Lucifer: With only a little effort any virtue can be turned into a vice. Surely you’ve heard
of “half-truths” – the other half is invariably a falsehood. And how about all those
“gossip” truths you humans seem to love… Many of them may be true, but it’s
deliciously evil to spread them among people who either don’t have the right to know, or
Dialogue Two
Lucifer: How much does a rock love falling to earth? My loathing of the One is directly
proportional to the relationship I once had in better times. It incites my every thought, it
motivates my every action. There is nothing I do that is not colored by my desire to hurt,
Lucifer: You’re right, but you’re also absolutely wrong. You’re right to the extent I can’t
hurt the One, but your wrong, too, because I can cause him incredible anguish when I
devour those the One loves. He’s helpless. He can only watch. And it’s anguishing
watching those you love be tormented in the hideous ways I have devised.
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Dialogue Three
Pilgrim: Well, once people know the truth about you, won’t you lose your power?
Lucifer: People already know the truth about me. And I’m doing just fine, thank you.
Pilgrim: They only think they know you. Won’t these dialogues let them know just how
Lucifer: Look, people are going to read this for two reasons: One group will read it to
confirm that I’m evil. They will continue to be wary. The other group will read it to
confirm that I’m evil. It will validate their opinion and they will thirst for the power I can
Pilgrim: Is it just that simple? People want what you can offer?
Lucifer: Of course! Look at what I can offer: power, success, adulation, honor, prestige,
wealth -- all those little hallmarks that you humans regard as “good”.
Pilgrim: But don’t the people who come to you for those things pay a high price?
Lucifer: What’s a high price? It depends on what you want. The stuff I offer is
Lucifer: You’re all hung up on just one part of the transaction. You’ve used a credit card
to get things you want, right? You couldn’t wait until you saved the money, you had to
have it…now. So in a sense you took a “risk” on the future that you’d be able to make
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the payments so you could enjoy your stuff now. Same with me. I offer stuff now.
Pilgrim: Do you really think people know what they’re getting into?
Lucifer: Of course not. But why should that concern me? That’s like asking a fisherman
Lucifer: Ahhh, you’ve heard the old expression, “No good deed goes unpunished.” ?
Well the One’s good deed was to create you humans with a free will. He wants you to
love him voluntarily. Nice concept, but the application leads to a lot of burnt cookies, if
Lucifer: Why not? You don’t need a college degree to know the rules of life. Everyone,
in at least one point in their lives, suspects the truth. But oftentimes the truth isn’t nearly
as glamorous as what I’m offering. And besides how bad can hell be if I’m here talking
with you.
Dialogue Four
Pilgrim: Can you really get inside my mind and know what I’m thinking.
Lucifer: Your mind is your own. It’s a sacred place where you’re allowed to make
choices. It’s a rare gift in the universe and is protected by the One. But I’ve discovered I
don’t need access to your mind to have you do my will. All I need is my eyes. And my
eyes study your eyes. When I see you focus on something, something that catches your
attention, I look at what you’re looking at. Your eyes do reveal your soul. I can know
The Son of the One gave my little secret away nearly two-thousand years ago.
Lucifer: That’s because you only read the words. You don’t make an effort to think
about what they mean. The Son of the One pointed out that someone who even “looks”
at a woman with desire has already committed the sin. The eyes revealed the temptation.
The willful desire makes the sin real. It’s already in the heart. Just because it isn’t
physically carried out doesn’t mean there wasn’t the desire, the will, to do it. Physical
acts, mental acts – they’re both actions. Actions you humans are responsible for because
Pilgrim: Why do you only call Jesus, the Son of the One?
Lucifer: His other names imply battles I’ve lost and will continue to lose in the future.
Dialogue Five
Lucifer: No, I just wanted to make a point – I’ve got lots of people down here. But I
must confess the place is decorated a lot nicer since they’ve been coming down in droves.
Lucifer: With a capitol “S”. Bad news. Really. But I can get a lot of mileage out of the
“human-ness” of it, how a loving One couldn’t possibly condemn such an earnest desire,
how “I gotta be me.” And if there’s one person who knows the consequences of “I gotta
Pilgrim: So it’s your ability to change perspective that makes sin seem likes it’s not sin?
Lucifer: You humans have some sort of strange notion that as long as someone is
“sincere” everything must be OK. Where’d you guys get that notion? Oh wait, that was
me… I’m so embarrassed… I should have recognized my handiwork! But, then, it does
go so far back in your history. It’s not by accident that “sincere” begins with the word
Lucifer: Think about it… What makes hitting your hand with a hammer wrong?
Pilgrim: It hurts…?
Lucifer: OK, you're catching on. The hammer is made to strike things, because that is
what it was designed for. It is the mis-use of the hammer that leads to problems – like
breaking the bones in your hand. Same with homosexuals, they’re using their hammers
They’ve made their penis the focus of their life. It’s how they define themselves. That
was my idea, by the way. Talk about creative! These guys take nature, stand it on its
Let me ask you, when’s the last time you’ve sucked up something with your anus? It’s
an exit system! It’s so obvious, really. One of my greatest con jobs was making the anus
into a receptacle. And there’s consequences. Same as if you drove the wrong way down
a freeway….
Pilgrim: Isn’t it out of character for you to be quite so “honest” about a deceit?
Lucifer: Yea, but man I’m proud of this one! You can’t believe how effective I’ve been!
All I do is take what is “natural” and sell you guys on its perversion. It’s disgusting even
Pilgrim: You’ve indicated some awe for creation. Was that a slip-up?
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Lucifer: Except for the creation of you misfits, I must confess an admiration for the rest
of creation. The order of it…the mind-boggling order of it. And my mind can run circles
around your mind any day of the week, month and year. And I’m telling you my mind
boggles at the creation surrounding you guys. The One has put more miracle into one
fruit fly than human kind will ever appreciate, little less understand.
diversion. If I think you’re approaching the truth you’d be surprised at what I can throw
in your path.
Lucifer: Exactly what you need to see, hear or feel to change your train of thought. A
pretty person of the opposite sex (or same sex in some cases), a haunting melody
(although I must confess I have great success with just natural sounds…many the dog
I’ve made bark or an unexpected pain to break what seems a special moment of closeness
to the One.) Chest pain is another favorite. Nothing takes your mind off the One like a
little chest pain. Truth be told, though, all I do is generate a little extra gas. Gas! Can
you believe it? What can distract a human from communion with the One? A fart! A
Lucifer: You know I thought this might be an interesting exercise, but your last question
really blows me away. Really. It makes me realize that just as much as you can’t
Listen to me carefully. Write it down so you don’t forget. Never, ever, forget
what I’m going to say next: NO ONE ENJOYS BEING IN HELL. Not even me. But
Lucifer: Yea, sure, love the place. You’d be surprised what we’ve done with the pits and
caverns. Home-y. Fung-shui. Fung-shit. The place reeks of sin, offal, excrement, and
everything foul. Hell is…there is no other word for it, hell. You’ve just gotten so use to
the word that it’s lost it’s meaning. But only for you. For those of us in it, hell never
looses its reality. And except for pride, we’d rather not be here. But then it’s a choice,
Dialogue Six
Lucifer: You know, that was a lot harder than you may think.
Lucifer: I’m a spirit. I’m appearing to you in a semblance of physical form just for your
comfort level. I know how you expect me to look and I’ve tried to fill that image. But
beyond this synthetic image I have fantastic abilities. But being spiritual doesn’t mean I
know everything. If I knew everything I would be the One. And I was on the lookout for
this so-called son of the One. So, if you think I’m good at camouflage and misdirection,
you can imagine the campaign the One directed against me and the discovery of the
Messiah.
At one point in His ministry (He was with his apostles at that point) I thought I
was close to the truth. And then He did, if you’ll excuse the expression, the damndest
thing – he cursed a fig tree. I mean, here’s this defenseless little fig tree. And even
though it was out of season, the son of the One curses the tree for not bearing fruit. How
could this irrational act possibly be the son of the One? I’d thought I’d found the
refutation I’d been looking for. In retrospect I realized his little “performance” had been
done just for my benefit – to throw me off guard. And damned if didn’t work!
My rule of thumb is, when in doubt, chop off a person’s head. I’d done it with
John the Baptist with some degree of success. At least I’d made that seven-veils dance
memorable. (Just between you and I, Herod’s wife’s daughter would’ve tripped over
herself trying to walk down a hallway. I was the one who made her body supple and
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inviting. I was the one who made sure the potentates at that dinner had sufficient wine
before her dance. I could have had a sow with psoriasis do that dance and everyone
would have been delighted. Oh, the arrangements and planning us “behind-the-scenes
But when he cursed that fig tree I figured he could not be the Messiah who was
expected. That little scriptural notation was done for MY benefit. A “red-herring” I
believe you would call it. In his unflagging devotion to you human creatures the Son of
the One didn’t put a human soul in jeopardy to throw me off the scent, he used a crummy
bush.
It was only after I’d gotten Judas to betray him (betrayal is one of my strong
points) that I’d begun to realize what heaven had sprung upon me. Thirty-three years
wasted! Hell, (excuse the expression) millennia wasted! This was the Son of the One.
This was the One for whom I’d been watching. He hadn’t been slaughtered with those
forty others at his birth! He’d survived, and if the crucifixion was allowed to proceed,
my doom would be sealed. Talk about a dilemma! I had to get Judas to stop…I had to
But then, like so many other contracts I’ve had with you contemptible creatures,
Judas decides to have a thought of his own: “I want the thirty pieces of silver.” I’m
pleading with this guy, “Forget the silver, we’ve got more serious issues here.” And he
says, “Silver, got to have that silver.” And, using his free-will he chooses the SILVER!
Not even gold, this guy sells his soul for SILVER! Can you believe it? What a wild card
the One made when he made you! So here I am whispering in his ear, don’t betray
him…don’t betray him… And what does that son of a human do, HE BETRAYS HIM!
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It was a nasty chain of events. I’m not exactly sure when I lost control, but this Judas
became just as much a problem to me as he’d become to the One. You know the rest….
If only I could have brought the crucifixion to a halt… I could have bought more time.
Dialogue Seven
Pilgrim: In scripture Jesus seems to cast out a lot of demons. Wait a second! Did I see
Pilgrim: Reflex?
Pilgrim: When I say “Jesus” you twitch, don’t you? There, there I saw you do it again!
Lucifer: Look, I don’t want you to make a big deal out of this and I’d prefer you didn’t
humble, perhaps even crush, your arrogance! I am not a figment of your imagination.
I’m one of the most powerful forces in your universe… It would be wise for you not to
forget that.
Lucifer: Oh most assuredly! Always respect what you do not know. And you do not
know me, but I know you. Even as we do our little conversations you secretly delight
that somehow you are putting something over on me. Just like a mouse thinks it will
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escape the toying of a cat. Cats have an amazing win/loss record for that game. Be very
careful my friend…
Lucifer: The One will try – but you humans have this uncanny ability to be arrogant and I
count on you to ignore the One’s warning whispers when you think you can handle it
alone.
Pilgrim: Wait a second, why does God only whisper? That doesn’t seem fair since you’re
Lucifer: See, this is how I work with your mind. I get you going in a certain direction
and then you start to ask questions without really thinking about them. You call it a
stream of consciousness – but it’s a stream where I can create numerous rapids. Only the
cautious will navigate the waters without mishap. I can have as many drenched victims
Your last question shows you hit my little “rapids.” Just this once I’m going to show you
how you hit the rocks. If you are standing close to someone you deeply care about would
you scream “I love you!” in their ear? Of course not! It wouldn’t be an act of love, it
would an act of idiocy. Well the One tries very hard to stay close to you, and if you’re
close to the One, you’ll hear his whisper. It’s that simple…. If you’re close to the One
you’ll hear the whisper. If you’re a mile a way, even the One’s shout won’t help.
Lucifer: Because the truth is an important tool. If I share enough truth with you, you will
Lucifer: Almost had you down the river on that. OK, the rule is, and it’s certainly not
my rule, that every knee must bend at the mention of that name.
Lucifer: You amaze me. Why are you surprised? I’m a scripture scholar. I watched
every word of it being written. I know the “book” inside and out. I even tried to get a
couple into circulation myself. I used to worry about certain revelations being made
known to you, but I’ve come to realize that just because the truth is there doesn’t mean
Pilgrim: How about when people say the name when they curse?
Lucifer: Doesn’t matter – it’s the “name.” It’s just bittersweet to have to acknowledge it
when people mis-use it. I love it when you humans disrespect the name but the twitches
Dialogue Eight
Pilgrim: I mean, can you tell me the name of a human who is now in hell?
Lucifer: No.
Lucifer: No, I mean I can’t tell you. It’s a rule the One has imposed on my little
Pilgrim: You said “roasting.” You meant that as a figure of speech, right?
Lucifer: Of course.
Pilgrim: I can’t.
Dialogue Nine
Pilgrim: We got off track the last time we talked. I wanted to know about Jesus casting
Lucifer: Yes, that’s what the Son of the One really did.
Pilgrim: So you’re saying you can really cause illness and disease in humans?
Lucifer: Normally you humans are so ill-disciplined I don’t have to go to the trouble.
But, yes, I know a thousand times more than your cleverest doctor. Your bodies are
fearfully and wonderfully made, but so am I. And my intellectual powers are immense
compared to your tiny capabilities. You don’t have to whack a person with a brick to get
an effect. I know how to work at the cellular level. For all of the abuse your bodies can
take they’re remarkably sensitive to the tiny tweakings I can give them. Thing is, to keep
the tweak going I have to assign one my guys to full time duty. But it’s usually worth it.
Lucifer: Not enough sleep last night? Think of it this way: You’ve just blown up a
balloon and you have your fingers on the tip – let go, the air goes out. Well that’s sort of
how we work – we blow up something in your body but have to stay there to keep it in
effect. When we’re forced to leave when the balloon empties and you have what you call
a “cure.”
To our credit we try to make your illnesses and diseases with “invisible” links to our
handiwork. Damned penicillin sure put a damper on some of our favorite techniques.
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Dialogue Ten
Lucifer: You bet – especially with a little bit of help from me. If the universe were
simply chaotic no one would know for sure what would happen next, but the universe is a
Pilgrim: I’m not talking about sunrise and sunsets. I mean people’s destinies. Do you
Lucifer: Yes. Well, mostly yes. Destinies aren’t that much different from sunrises and
sunsets as you may think. After all you are a creature in this universe.
Lucifer: True, but that doesn’t mean you actually take the time to use it. You must have
dozens of things that you own but you’re not using them right now.
Lucifer: Ahhhh, but I do…it’s you who’s not catching on… Let me put it this way, just
because you have a free will doesn’t mean you exercise it. Like any form of exercise it
requires both “will power” and “work.” And you humans are notorious for lacking the
But even beyond the physical realm you live in a dynamic spiritual reality. And
that reality is not chaotic either. The One’s game plan for your soul requires an orderly
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play out of events. It gets down to the difference between “predestined” and
Lucifer: About the same as a surgeon cutting you with scalpel and a mugger stabbing
you with a knife! You’ll bleed from both but one will help heal and the other can cause
death. Luckily you’re talking to someone who understands these things. Listen up!
Predestined means you were designed to ultimately be with the One. Predetermined
means you have no choice in the matter. Predestined refers to the game plan, but it does
Lucifer: Let’s try it this way. You’re the captain of a boat and it’s your job to get to a
specific safe harbor. You pick the charts, you pick your crew, plus all the other stuff like
your speed and how you’ll react to any possible storms you encounter. So there’s plenty
Lucifer: Well, as a player in a predestined game plan, you don’t get to choose the boat (it
could be anything from a garbage scow to a cruise ship), you don’t get to choose the
water you’ll sail on (it could a lake or an ocean), and you don’t get to choose the port.
All of those things are already laid out as part of the universal game plan.
And because of my elevated spiritual powers I can take a look at that plan. And if
I choose I can share some of the “possibilities” of those future events. But I usually
Lucifer: Silly boy, that’s not the price I’m referring to. My little glimmers of the future
can be pretty unfortunate for my victim. But before you get all hot and bothered blaming
Lucifer: Two reasons. By revealing a couple of scenarios that are true I build up
confidence in my victim (I mean that in the most positive sense) to trust my words – but
it’s always a nasty mistake! When I have your confidence is when I alter the visions to
fit my needs – and unfortunately for you my needs are the exact opposite of yours. But
hey, you choose to be gullible, so I guess I can choose to take advantage of it. I have a
Lucifer: I’m letting you in on some of the better plays in my little book of diabolical
stratagems, but I’m just so proud of how clever they are. Not only are you suckered in to
believing “false” information, but you also begin to rely on my information. Is that a
Pilgrim: Rely?
Lucifer: You’ve led a pretty sheltered life, haven’t you? No matter. By rewarding your
questions with correct answers you begin to depend on me to make your decisions for
you. And that’s something I’m only too happy to do. As you rely on me more and more,
Pilgrim: But the One says we should rely on him. Isn’t that giving up my free will too?
Lucifer: Normally I let the One defend his own positions, but no, it’s not the same. To
constantly choose the One is to exercise your free will. But the One is calling you to one
kingdom, and I am calling you to another. The distinction is in the result. Heaven or my
place.
Lucifer: Sometimes. But which time they’re right is a wild card. That’s why your Bible
forbids it. It’s not that it can’t be done and it’s not that the answers are wrong. It’s that
the answers could be wrong and you wouldn’t know the difference. Tricky, eh?
Lucifer: Not knowingly. Some of my best stooges are the ones who don’t realize who
they’re getting their power from. But the “power” I give them is intoxicating, it’s pretty
heady stuff. Once you taste it you’ve got to have more. Sort of like potato chips.
Pilgrim: But some of them seem like genuine and kind people.
Pilgrim: Oh……
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Dialogue Eleven
Lucifer: Well, look at this way, we’re equally matched. He’s an angel, I’m an angel.
Pilgrim: It’s seems strange to hear you call your legions angels.
Lucifer: We are what we are. You folks seem to get all kinds of giddy thinking about
good little angels, cherubs, wispy ladies with swords or armloads of musical instruments.
But what about us? I mean, really! We’re right in there with your daily lives. But
Noooo, nobody thinks we truly exist. It’s a real embarrassment. I mean for the last few
human generations I’ve been right out front. I’ve been strutting my stuff. But where’s
the recognition? If nothing else we deserve your respect for being the warriors we are.
We fight a mean game of life and death – and we know how to win.
We’re collecting souls by the truckload, but unless we make a little girl’s head
spin around and spew out pea soup, we’re nothing! When will you people get a grip?
We’re real. We’re powerful. We’re bad – bad to the depths of your soul!
See, you’ve got me started on a sore spot… I do my best work while undercover,
but sometimes a guy needs a little recognition, a little applause from the crowd. Screams
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I get – plenty of screams – there’s Excedrin headache days down in hell! But where’s the
I’m the mighty Lucifer!!! I can throw planets off their courses. I can annihilate
whole cities. I’m a force to be reckoned with. And here I am stuck with a bunch of
groupies in hell who decide, after the fact, they’d rather be somewhere else. Screw ‘em.
They got their turn to play in the lights! They got their fat bankrolls to indulge
Lucifer: Michael, Michael, Michael. I swear the name makes me want to puke. You’ve
got a statue of Michael there. He’s got his damn foot on my head. Does that seem like a
Pilgrim: I think it’s supposed to show he’s stronger than you. That he’s going to win the
Lucifer: He can’t win diddly-squat by himself. He can only win if the One helps him.
Pilgrim: But isn’t that exactly what’s going to happen? He will get God’s help.
Lucifer: You’re annoying. You dwell on the negative. I bet you’re looking forward to
your next toothache. It’s not like I spend my time moping around hell just thinking about
possible future events. Well, actually I do, just not that event.
Lucifer: IF you’ve offended? What are you telling me? Your mouth just opens and
words fall out? No more talk about Michael. We’re here to talk about me. Just me. Got
it?
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Dialogue Twelve
Pilgrim: Well, how do you, a spirit without a physical body, work in a temporal world?
Lucifer: Wait just a second… Let me measure something here. Let’s see, I’m looking at
about a 23 inch hat size, not counting the blow-dry and mousse. Gosh, your head is just
too darn small. I’d explain it to you but you there just ain’t room for all the brains you
need. But don’t feel too bad, none of you have the brain power.
Lucifer: I’ll give it a shot. When your eyes glaze over, I’ll stop. You live your life
depend on any type of cycle whatsoever. And even though time is relative I can dip into
it without it affecting me at all. Sort of like you putting your hand in a stream to catch a
fish. The fish is on a completely different lifecycle. Its lifetime may be a year or two.
Its environment is water. Yet here you come and just put your hand in and grab it.
Pilgrim: Just when I think I’m getting it, I realize I’m not…
Lucifer: Exactly.
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Dialogue Thirteen
Lucifer: Interestingly it depends on a tiny little quirk in the universe. It’s something
we’ve talked about before, but it has a special application here. The people who invite me
Lucifer: It’s plenty fair, hear me out. How did the One create the universe?
Lucifer: Yes he willed it, but HOW did the One bring it about?
Lucifer: Bingo! Words have meaning, but just as important, words have power. When
the One let Adam name the animals he bestowed on him power normally reserved for the
One himself.
Pilgrim: You’re saying words have an effect no matter if the effect is intended?
Lucifer: Bingo again. This could be your lucky day. Expressions like “Go to hell” and
“Damn you” are real words with real power. Even if they’re said without full knowledge
of their outcome, they are still real words with real power. When they’re said in the heat
of anger it’s like they’ve gone through an amplifier into woofers that would knock your
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socks off. If I wouldn’t have heard it when it was whispered, I sure hear it when it’s
shouted.
And when I hear requests like that I hustle my butt up to the One’s customer
service department and ask if I can do what’s been asked of me. Sometimes the answer is
yes and sometimes the answer is no. What’s important to you, sometimes the answer is
yes.
Pilgrim: You mean to say a simple curse can allow you to enter a soul?
Lucifer: I didn’t say that. A curse can allow me to enter a body. Why do you think the
One prohibits cursing? Cursing is hell’s American Express card – it gets us where we
want to go.
Pilgrim: It’s not fair that someone could say something and make it happen without
Lucifer: It happens all the time. Contrary to popular opinion, ignorance is not always
bliss. You probably sneak through some traffic lights as they’re changing to red. Just
because you get away with it a few times in a row doesn’t mean you should get away
Pilgrim: Well then how come it’s so easy to let you in, but so difficult to get you out?
Lucifer: You’re asking without thinking again… If it was a “bad” person who cursed
and let me in, what kind of person would be necessary to get me out?
Lucifer: And you guess correctly. How many good people are there? I mean “good”
people… not just kinda, not just sorta, not just better than some… I’m talking really
good here.
Lucifer: You got that right. There’s times when I’m almost embarrassed at how few
really good people there are. I can still remember the look on Lot’s face when he tried to
find a few.
Lucifer: You’ve changed the rules. A priest has special powers given to him by the One.
But that doesn’t necessarily make it easy. In fact, unless he is a very good priest, I’ve
been known to simply exchange bodies, the previous victim for his. That can be a
shocker let me tell you. At least these days they’re not wearing those annoying roman
Lucifer: No, not unless I’m invited to do that too. And there are those who make that
invitation. But typically I can take control of the body. Remember that your soul and
Lucifer: I’ve only been asked that question once before. Yes, there is. It’s a little
hallmark item that all of my minions instantly recognize. It’s a kind of smile. Do you
Lucifer: Interesting, that’s what the other guy said when I offered him the same deal…
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Dialogue Fourteen
Lucifer: No, this is a special arrangement. I’ll give you a couple of choices. But please
don’t pick a swine. I still get annoyed when I think about the last time that happened.
Lucifer: Ahhh, we’re dealing with a literalist here. OK, but here’s the deal, when I
change I want you to look into my eyes, I mean really stare into them, OK? But let’s not
do the corny poof of smoke thing…how about you just blink for a second.
Pilgrim: Oh my god!
Lucifer: Pretty compelling, eh? The length and size sort of take your breath away don’t
Lucifer: Oh come on, don’t leave the party early. Let me come up to your eye level. You
Lucifer: All right, all right… Eve had more guts than you…
Pilgrim: I don’t care. But, speaking of Eve, I hear you’re pretty good at appearing as a
beautiful woman… I must confess I’d like to see what you’d come up with.
Lucifer: Hardly.
Lucifer: Well that’s a little tougher. I am a spirit after all. But I suppose I can appear to
you for a moment or so as what I actually represent to mortal humans. One condition
though… no vomiting.
Pilgrim: No vomiting?
Lucifer: Upchucking, hurling, whatever. Trust me, it’s a reasonable request. Let’s have
that blink.
Pilgrim: Aaaarghhhhhhhh…
Lucifer: Hmmm. And yet a moment ago you wanted me. Guess you just wanted what
you saw… how come you don’t love me for who I am?
Pilgrim: Please… Wait just a sec while I clean myself up a little…. There…. Thank you
for your handkerchief. Wait, one more question, can you appear as goodness?
Lucifer: First, I don’t want the handkerchief back. Please keep it with my compliments.
Just forget the fact that it’s made out of silk and monogrammed… Yesssss (excuse me
slip of the tongue – old habits are hard to break) Yes, I can.
Lucifer: I’ll show you my best. This was a show-stopper back in the 600’s. You’re
going to see me do the “grande jete” of your human ballet of life. Please blink.
Lucifer: Ahhh, I banished him. You can’t see it, but I have my foot on his head.
Pilgrim: Gabriel, I must confess I was so afraid. Lucifer can do so many things I didn’t
even imagine…
Lucifer: Now, now… Be at peace, I am with you. Lucifer is gone… gone for good. But
there are a few things I’d like to straighten out about this Jesus of Nazareth. He wasn’t
the Son of the One. Nice guy, but no God. Got a pen handy? That’s OK, I’ll help you
Dialogue Fifteen
Lucifer: Silly question. I think breaking the commandments should be a daily sport. I
think we should have competitions to see who can break the most.
Pilgrim: That’s not what I mean. Are you involved in every sin?
Lucifer: As much as I’d like to take credit for all the insane situations you find yourself
Lucifer: It’s like this. First there was the One. The eternal One. No beginning, no
middle, no end. I must confess this is even a mystery to me… Don’t think about it too
Anyhow, the One then chose to create angels. Now remember, we’re spirits. We
don’t exist in a time frame. So we, within a moment of our creation, understood the
game plan. No surprises. No university degrees here…we understood it all. And within
what you would call micro-seconds, some of us said “Wait a second (figure of speech
again) we don’t buy into this…” And gosh if we didn’t end up at the Motel 6 of the
universe. I mean we’ve got a lot, but there’s a lot we don’t have. No mints on pillows
down in hell.
So then comes the first humans. Did you know you guys are made out of dirt?
Yeah, we were surprised too. Anyhow that’s when I got my first chance to see if you
were going to be so gosh awful wonderful. Now my first impression is you weren’t so
terribly bright, but you did have a sort of innocent quality. A sort of “Hey, little girl,
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would you like a candy bar?” “Yes, kind stranger.” type of thing. So I got permission
from the One to try a little test. For a God who claims to be all-knowing I can’t believe
the One was surprised at the outcome. But, nevertheless, there I was groveling in the dirt
So what this means is, you are a child of your first parents. Parents who managed
to (drum roll please) sin. The first test, and I won! Can you believe it? Drinks were on
the house down in hell! And yet, the victory has certain haunting qualities to it…
Anyhow, the One decided to take into account that you miserable creatures
(nothing personal intended), as sons and daughters of Adam and Eve, were being born
under a handicap… a “fallen” nature if you will. And if life were a golf game, he gave
you strokes. I mean, he gave you strokes upon strokes. I cannot believe what he saw in
you creatures of dust! He’s giving you slack! We’ll never forgive him for that.
Lucifer: Because the One’s merciful doesn’t mean the One isn’t just.
Dialogue Sixteen
Lucifer: Michael a little, but only because he’s a worthy adversary. But there is one
other…
Pilgrim: God?
Pilgrim: Mary?
Lucifer: Funny thing about her. She is also made of dirt. But she is more like Eve
before the fall than the rest of you creatures. I’d never met anyone, and I do mean
anyone, who kept the One’s will first and foremost in her mind and conduct.
Lucifer: Not directly. I mean she’s a woman. How terrifying can that be? Anyhow the
One appears to have given a promise to this creature of dust and mud that she will
eventually crush my head. Now I ask you, is that a nice thing to do?
Lucifer: Boy, you sure know how to make a fellow feel like he’s among friends. But I
do worry about this. The One may have done a lot of things I’ve not immediately
understood, but I’m sure not comfortable with how this will eventually play out.
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Lucifer: Get a grip! Do you think anyone could have become the mother of the One?
You’re betraying your puny ability to think deep thoughts. Of course she’s special.
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Dialogue Seventeen
Lucifer: Hmmm. Didn’t expect that… Let me think. OK, why is it so easy for me to
dupe you? Granted you have a fallen nature, but that shouldn’t make you idiots. Why do
Pilgrim: It’s even easier than you may think. We live in a physical world with physical
sensations. Unless we take time to consider the other possibilities of our spiritual nature,
the physical world pretty much overwhelms us. Sort of like trying to hear a whisper in a
rock concert.
Lucifer: Yes, but that only explains the obstacles. Surely you have the ability to get over
them?
Pilgrim: Yes and no. Unfortunately with our first parent’s sin we changed the nature of
things. Since everything was created for us (please don’t take offense) the sin set up an
unfortunate chain of events. What had been immortality in a physical sense, a life
without pain, a life without strife, became its opposite. We were doomed to die, doomed
to suffer, and to face conflict every moment of our lives. The only thing that gave life
meaning was the confidence, so often only the suspicion, that there was more than what
Lucifer: So what? If you have both a physical nature and a spiritual nature why aren’t
Pilgrim: Because of you. It’s not just our ability to make a decision, it’s your ability to
influence our choice. And I must admit you have some pretty awesome qualities.
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Lucifer: I’m not sure it’s a compliment, but thank you for noticing.
Pilgrim: When we’re not wallowing in the total physical aspect of our lives, the spiritual
side offers a conflict. A sort of “Stuff” versus “Soul” combat. Now since “Stuff” can
only a last a lifetime, but a “Soul” is immortal, you’d think we could decide better.
But when you got our first parents to sin you changed creation forever. We can
no longer hold grace. The cracks in our nature let it seep out. The only think that gives
us any hope is a Redeemer. Someone who can superglue out nature back together and
make it leak proof. The appearance of wholeness isn’t enough… It’s got to be leak-
proof. The Son of the One is both our superglue and our sealer.
Lucifer: Strange isn’t it? It almost seems like I shouldn’t be able to have any victories at
all…
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Dialogue Eighteen
Lucifer: Typically you help me keep your guardian angel at bay. He can’t do any more
than you let him – it’s part of that free will thing.
Lucifer: No, I only mean he can’t do something that would interfere with your free will.
He can’t stop you from sinning, but he can help if you ask.
Pilgrim: I was always led to believe that our guardian angels help us all the time without
us knowing it.
Lucifer: Point taken. Okay, as a matter of fact, be grateful your angel doesn’t have to be
paid overtime.
Lucifer: Because deciding whether to sin or not isn’t the only thing that’s going on in
your life. At least it shouldn’t be… You are also swimming in events that could cause
you grave misfortune or unexpected good luck. Remember that last time you swerved
out of the way of an accident about to happen? You didn’t think you had a chance. Well,
you didn’t. That extra inch of clearance was a gift. You assumed you’d misjudged the
distance, but you got it right – your angel perturbed the universe just for your benefit.
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Lucifer: Yeah, that’s me, old prankster Lucifer. You can’t imagine the chuckles I get
down in hell.
Pilgrim: But, if what you’re saying is true, why do people get in accidents?
Lucifer: Because the One has a plan… And I must confess much of that plan is a
Lucifer: You can absolutely bank on the fact he will try to help, but sometimes events
must be allowed to play out. Have you any idea how many angels wanted to step in and
protect the son of the One from Calvary. Legions of them! Legions! It was one of
Lucifer: Beats me. I thought you should have cashed it in… But hey it wasn’t your
Pilgrim: But surely that time isn’t as “fixed” as you make it out to be?
Lucifer: Now that’s an interesting point. It’s true. That time can be manipulated… But
Lucifer: You bet. Big time benefit. It’s sort of the “golden parachute” of hell. An
Lucifer: You got it. No one has the authority to preempt the One’s will on this. Doesn’t
mean it can’t be done, just means no one has the authority. Down here in Hell we
Lucifer: You’re listening pretty close aren’t you? Is it because I’m that interesting or
Lucifer: Funny thing about your world… You exist in physical time but your “rigid”
time is a whole lot more “plastic” than you think. As fast as a bullet goes, the human will
can go faster… You wouldn’t believe the ones I’ve lost in the last nanoseconds of their
lives.
Some day I’ve got an interesting story about Judas I’d like to share.
Lucifer: Sorry, hell’s guest book is for members only at this time. You’re not a member.
Yet….
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Dialogue Nineteen
Pilgrim: Yes, it was one of heaven’s minor angels that got to tell the mighty Lucifer what
Dialogue Twenty
Pilgrim: What harm can it do? You’ve already made the point we humans typically
Lucifer: Okay, here it is. The biggie. The supersized menu item that adds tons of
Lucifer: Ahhh, grasshopper, listen once again as the master explains. Wipe on, wipe
off… No wait, that’s a different lesson…. Try it this way… I think you’ll catch on
before I finish the explanation. Is there anything wrong with ordering fast food?
Pilgrim: No.
Pilgrim: They say supersizing only adds calories to a meal that already has too much fat
and sugar.
Lucifer: Un-huh. And that used to be called “gluttony.” It was one of the seven deadly
sins. (Still is by the way.) In the old days it meant spiritually deadly, but nowadays it
Lucifer: Bingo! Someone once said that taking any virtue to its extreme is a vice. (That
was me, by the way.) They were absolutely right. (I love it when I’m right.) You don’t
fall off a tightrope when you’re balanced. You only fall when you lean too far in one
direction.
Lucifer: Of course they can. But that’s because your word “love” means so many
different things. Love, in the sense the One intended, cannot be taken to extremes. But
the way you humans use “love” can be pretty despicable. Down here in Hell we
continually marvel at how our potential attendance figures soar when we hear you say
things like, “But I love him…” or “It must be okay because we love each other…”
Pilgrim: That’s not fair. You’re talking about people who are caught up in an emotional
Lucifer: Yes, the One knows your weakness. But the One has also put a fire in your soul
to aspire to the good. He takes a dim view of you smothering that fire with feelings you
Dialogue Twenty-One
Pilgrim: Wait, we’ve talked about this. You just do good stuff just to trap people into
trusting you.
Lucifer: You keep giving me these disapproving looks. You’re being pretty
unreasonable yourself.
Pilgrim: Oh?
Pilgrim: Sometimes.
Pilgrim: Yeah.
Lucifer: So some day I plant the thought “there’s nobody around I can go a lot faster”
Lucifer: All those other times you didn’t get caught. I was the one distracting the cop. I
was the one that made him look down or realize he had an itch… I was busy doing
“good” things for you. I was responsible for your not getting caught earlier. I am just so
Lucifer: No, I don’t. You thought it was “good” in the very same sense when you didn’t
get tickets.
Lucifer: I did.
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Dialogue Twenty-Two
Pilgrim: Since you’re actually pure spirit, why do you have the reputation for being
Pilgrim: OK, Hello. Now why, when we’re supposed to be seeing you for who you truly
Pilgrim: I’m thinking it isn’t… That the One doesn’t allow you to deceive completely…
Pilgrim: Really?
Lucifer: Really.
Lucifer: Because to me it isn’t disgusting. It’s simply a tool to cause you to realize the
immensity of my power. True, I may appear to you to be repulsive, but I also appear as
mighty and worthy of fear. Intimidation is not to be taken lightly… If I wanted I could
Pilgrim: It’s great – it’s just not true. For you to be able to always “deceive” without
revealing your true nature would seriously jeopardize our ability to make a good choice.
Pilgrim: For you to have total power over your activities would make you equal to the
Dialogue Twenty-Three
Lucifer: It’s an honor of noteworthy merit. Before me, evil didn’t exist. I am its
Pilgrim: But in our talks I see you as an actor who has assumed a costume. What are you
Lucifer: Why? Do you think I am the only one who can alienate the One?
Pilgrim: No, it’s just that I imagined you’re in a special league of your own.
Lucifer: Of course I am. But that doesn’t mean we can’t share hell. If we live in the
Lucifer: Fine with me. But why do you want to be the dog?
Lucifer: Oh come on now… Just how arrogant can you, as clump of clay, be? You’re
made from dirt, man! I’m pure spirit, and a damn powerful one at that!
Pilgrim: Yes, but I’m made in the One’s image and likeness.
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Lucifer: Big whoop! That’s not a reference to the physical you moron… It’s a reference
to your free will and your ability to subdue all of the One’s creation. I, too, can split
mountains and create waves that engulf half a continent! Let’s see you do that!
Lucifer: Why? Because you guys are worthy of it? Give me a break…
Lucifer: So, you’d use evil to destroy evil? Sort of like putting out a fire with gasoline
Lucifer: Really! You are naïve! Wars may start for “good” causes but their
implementation is all my doing! War is my “royal flush” playing poker with you puny
reckless emotions and the wallowing in sin. War is my game. The trouble with you is
you equate war with justice. Maybe it could happen if each of you who participated in it
was perfect, but humanity is far from perfect! And how many of you revel in your
wantonness!
Lucifer: So? You make such a big deal out of that. Even the Son of the One died!
Where’s the surprise? Do any of you actually think you’re going to become immortal
without going through the process? That’s not hope – that’s stupidity. You’re gonna die!
Lucifer: You know these interviews are tedious enough… But don’t you do any
preparation before you ask me these questions? How can death be a defeat? Was your
birth a defeat?
Pilgrim: All right, I admit I’m not your intellectual equal, but death is pretty serious to
us.
Lucifer: Your death is serious to me too! How do you think I keep adding suburbs to
hell? It’s the overflow crowd from these past few centuries. You guys keep knocking at
the gates and we have to keep making more grates and ovens. Don’t get me wrong…
Every room in hell is a Motel 6. Nothing fancy… Just the bare essentials… You won’t
Lucifer: There goes your career as a talk show host! You’d be surprised how many of
Michael: Lucifer…
Lucifer: Oh bad Lucifer, bad Lucifer. I’ll go sit in the corner awhile. How’s that?
Michael: Lucifer, you’ve been pretty straightforward in these dialogues, but God thinks
Lucifer: Oh sure, leave it to the One to protect His little pieces of dirt.
Michael: Lucifer… You were created just like me… You could have chosen the One…
Lucifer: Yeah right. We’re equal all right. But you, you’re a peon to a clump of dust, a
chunk of clay. You, the essence of power and knowledge, you serve the worms rather
Michael: But the One loves the worms! And I love the One.
Lucifer: Yeah, right. A four-year old may love worms, but they grow up. You haven’t!
Michael: No, Lucifer, you almost got it right. But I don’t serve the worms, I serve the
Lucifer: Right! So what? How many screams have you gotten lately?
Lucifer: Go to hell!
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Dialogue Twenty-Four
Pilgrim: Is Lucifer permanently lost? I mean even Jesus had admiration for those
Michael: That’s true. Because to be committed means you are directing your efforts to a
Michael: Not really. Remember God created Lucifer. And God always loves His
creation. What makes Lucifer evil is not God’s design, it is Lucifer’s own response to
God’s plan.
Michael: It’s an intriguing question. But asking that question now is like trying to
determine the outcome of a war before it is played out. And right now we’re in the midst
of the war. A war for your soul, and the millions of other human souls God has created.
What we do know is that our side will triumph. But triumph to the point of the
conversion of hell? That question remains locked in God’s wisdom. All that’s really
important is your personal victory. The rest becomes curiosity. And curiosity can lead a
Dialogue Twenty-Five
Lucifer: True, schmoo… My power may be limited but it can also be devastating. And
that’s what’s important for you to remember. I can make your personal life hell. I can
put you to a test that is within a micron of everything you can bear. And few make me go
even that far… You wallow in the mud you’re made of…
Lucifer: Why not? We’re made of the same stuff. We know the same stuff…
Lucifer: Here’s an irony for you – because I wanted to devote my total existence to
Lucifer: Not quite. The One told me I had to serve you. Disgusting, insignificant,
corporal you. It was like a woman asking a man who was madly in love with her to skip
60
the dates and only take her dog for walks instead… Sorry, bro… Does love, for the sake
Pilgrim: But how about if the woman went on the walks with the man? Wouldn’t that
Pilgrim: Isn’t God also serving man by his Son becoming one of us? He’s not asking
Lucifer: Look, Jack, that rationale may keep you from despair, but I’m far closer to the
truth than you are. Your divine privilege disgusts me, your very existence is repulsive,
and I loathe your dirty little physical bodies. And I will do all in my power to convince
And I’m taking legions of you down with me. Hell will not be a lonely place!
And you know why? Because so many of you choose me. Me! The mighty Lucifer!
Millions of you weak-willed creatures of dust will choose what I offer! Me! My gifts! I
give you what you really want… If I didn’t satisfy your desires there wouldn’t be a soul
Maybe I haven’t discovered the temptation that will take you down yet, but day
and night I search for it. And when I find it you’ll see whose side you’ll choose. You’ll
want me! My gifts! You’ll be willing to pay my price! And I’ll gladly accept payment.
You puny little particle of snot. Do you think we’ve been having a dialog?
We’ve been playing mental games… But the game is fixed! You’re not my equal! You
were the last thing made… You weren’t one of the first thoughts of the One. I was!
Pilgrim: Because, for all of your intelligence, for all of your power, for all of your
legions, you are doomed. And that’s because of the unsurpassable power of the One who
loves us. I admit I don’t understand why. But He does. And it His love that will, if I
cooperate with it, allow me to reject your best temptation. I may fall, but it won’t be the
Dialogue Twenty-Seven
Pilgrim: Well, I mean, for much of what we’ve talked about you haven’t exactly been the
essence of evil…
Pilgrim: Because you were originally created “good” and I suspect at some level some
Pilgrim: To be the essence of evil, you would have to be the opposite of the essence of
good – but only God can be that. Therefore to be the essence of evil you would have to
be God’s equal – and you’re not. So, I guess I figured there must be goodness in your
being somewhere…
Lucifer: So you’re saying hell is filled with “good” people who did bad things?
Lucifer: Well….
Pilgrim: Wait, wait, wait…. You’ve turned my idea on its head. There aren’t any good
people in hell.
Lucifer: Because?
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Pilgrim: Because even though they may not be totally evil, they have made decisions
that alienate them from God. They have diminished their own goodness voluntarily and
Lucifer: So do you still think that somewhere down deep I’m good?
Pilgrim: Of course. But it is so deep, so dormant, for all practical purposes it doesn’t
exist.
Lucifer: Ahhh…. “for all practical purposes” you say… Do you think it would be
Pilgrim: No….
Pilgrim: You are who you are. I think your resentment is eternal.
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Dialogue Twenty-Eight
Lucifer: You ought to take a closer look at some of the other people who call themselves
Pilgrim: Well, I’ve got a question that’s been somewhat puzzling to me. I thought
Pilgrim: The focus of Christianity is on the redemption God’s Son earned by his
crucifixion and resurrection. Doesn’t crucifixion seem an extravagant penalty for Adam
Lucifer: Hmmm. Lots of people are where you’re at. But in fact absolutely nothing less
Lucifer: Okay, let’s take it from the beginning. Would you say that the One made an
outrageous demand on Adam and Eve when he forbid them to eat the apple?
Pilgrim: No…
Lucifer: That’s an important point. The One didn’t forbid them to do something
necessary, but something completely trivial. It wasn’t essential they eat that apple. They
were in Eden. They were in paradise. Plenty of other trees. Plenty of other apples.
That’s what made the One’s command so powerful – it’s absolute lack of necessity. It
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was a command that was given to simply test Adam and Eve’s will. See, it was just their
decision that made it dangerous and caused the fracture of man’s relationship with the
One. And the One’s promise, or threat if you prefer, came true: Your parents did then
learn everything they wished they never knew about evil. Actually good and evil, but I
Pilgrim: Okay, so they ate the apple. Why would the Son have to be crucified? Why not
Lucifer: Wow, you really don’t get it. Your parents decided to willfully disobey the
One. They refused to submit to the One’s authority. They attempted to make themselves
equal to the One by assuming the authority to eat the forbidden fruit. And they did all
this for something as trivial as an apple… an apple they didn’t even need.
Lucifer: Wait a second here. Be careful where you decide to start laying blame… I only
tempted them. They decided! I only made it seem like a good idea. They embraced it.
It was their decision. THEIR decision. The decision to obey the One is a commitment
on the part of the soul. It isn’t subject to reason. If the rule is “Don’t stand on the train
tracks when a train is coming.” The rule stands as it is. You don’t get to reason through
whether it’s a good idea or if the speed of the train will make a difference in the outcome.
Your first parents failed in their commitment, not just their ability to reason. I could only
deceive them when they opened up the possibility of breaking their commitment of
Lucifer: I want you to figure this out for yourself. Too many people out there depend on
other people for their answers. I want you to figure it out. It’s a point of pride for me
Lucifer: Damn right, yes. I inspired it. It is an adventure into pain that is sublime. At
least sublime from my perspective. Nerve endings ripped apart, excruciating pain
whenever the victim takes a breath, and the ability to sustain that pain for days or even
weeks. I took the basic beauty of the One’s creation of your body and all of its survival
mechanisms and stood them on their head. Everything that is supposed to help now
becomes a source of agony. It’s brilliant. By breathing to stay alive you increase your
Lucifer: No one realizes. There isn’t a painting or statue made that captures the
perfection of pain I introduced to the world with the invention of crucifixion. Now it’s
all clean and neat. A sad man on a cross. That’s all. If you only knew what it really
looked like. And I especially love those new resurrection crosses! They’re not a tribute
to the Son of the One. They’re a tribute to me! I’ve actually got you another step
Pilgrim: I think you’re making my point for me. Why a crucifixion for just being
disobedient?
Lucifer: No. This time you’re going to figure it out. What was Adam and Eve’s actual
Pilgrim: Wait, I think I get it. Eating the apple actually happened after the sin. The
Lucifer: Bingo. So here’s your first parents breaking their relationship with the One over
Lucifer: You got it. An act of perfect obedience. And an act of perfect obedience
couldn’t be over something trivial. It would have to be over something that would take
the entire willpower of the person who had to correct it. Something that that person
would probably desperately not want to obey. Like the decision to go through with a
heinous penalty for crime they didn’t commit. Do you see where this is going?
Pilgrim: I think so. Christ redeemed the sin by obeying the Father at every point where
His body was screaming at him to quit. From the agony in the garden, to the scourging,
to the crowing of thorns, to the carrying of the cross, to the final nailing on the cross, He
could have said “Enough!” and stopped the process. It was only through his total and
Pilgrim: I’d never thought about the crucifixion like that before.
Lucifer: No, I mean I’m glad I was so successful in preventing you from thinking about
it until now.
Lucifer: Beats the hell out of me. Why the One needed little clay toys when he already
Dialogue Twenty-Nine
Pilgrim: Okay, but how do I know you’re telling “me” the truth.
Lucifer: But then why come to me for answers? Because you humans find it tantalizing
to “know.” That’s how I tempted your original parents and the fruit doesn’t seem to fall
Lucifer: But you can learn enough to make a fortune… And for some that’s a pretty
good deal.
tangible, desirable, intoxicating. A poorly understood spiritual dimension years down the
Pilgrim: But if you’re not real how could I get the fortune?
Lucifer: Perhaps in conceptualizing me you’re just tapping into your hidden psychic
powers. Powers you’ve always had. And in your mind game you expose yourself to
Lucifer: Oh, there’s plenty of proof. You’ll just have to wait and see…
Lucifer: Oh they’re nasty and they’re physical all right. But if they were convincing