CaseNo.

SCSL200416T
THEPROSECUTOROF
THESPECIALCOURT
V.
ALEXTAMBABRIMA
BRIMABAZZYKAMARA
SANTIGIEBORBORKANU

FRIDAY,27OCTOBER2006
9.15A.M.
STATUSCONFERENCE

TRIALCHAMBERII

BeforetheJudges:RichardLussick,Presiding
TeresaDoherty
JuliaSebutinde

ForChambers:MrSimonMeisenberg

FortheRegistry:MsAdveraKamuzora

FortheProsecution:MrKarimAgha
MrCharlesHardaway
MrVincentWagona
MsMajaDimitrova(CaseManager)
MrSeanMorrison(intern)
MsLeighLawrie

FortheaccusedAlexTambaMrKojoGraham
Brima:

FortheaccusedBrimaBazzyMrAndrewWilliamKodwoDaniels
Kamara:

FortheaccusedSantigieBorborMrAjibolaEManlySpain
Kanu:MrSilasCherkera

BRIMAETALPage2
27OCTOBER2006OPENSESSION

1[AFRC27OCT06AMD]

2Friday,27October2006

3[Opensession]

4[Theaccusedpresent]

5[StatusConference]

6[Uponcommencingat9.15a.m.]

7PRESIDINGJUDGE:Yes,well,goodmorning.Thisisa

8statusconferenceforthepurposesindicatedinourscheduling

9orderof26October.Well,withreferencetotheagenda

10mentionedtherein,weshouldfirststartwiththeDefence,who

11areundernoobligationatalltofileafinaltrialbriefor

12presentaclosingargument.So,let'sstartwiththeDefence

13counselandfindoutwhethertheyintendtodoso.

14MRGRAHAM:Goodmorning,YourHonours.

15PRESIDINGJUDGE:Goodmorning,MrGraham.

16MRGRAHAM:YourHonours,thatisthecase,Ibelieve,at

17leastonbehalfofthefirstaccusedinthismatter,andI

18believealsoinrespectofthesecondandthirdaccusedthatwe

19willbefilingclosingbriefsinresponsetothatofthe

20Prosecution,butYourHonour,furtheron,inrespectoftheother

21relatedissues,wehadameetingyesterdaywithour

22JUDGESEBUTINDE:Sorry,MrGraham,yousaidyouwillbe

23filingabrief?

24MRGRAHAM:Yes,thatisso,YourHonour.YourHonour,I

25wassayingthatwehadameetingyesterdaywithourfriendson

26theothersideandIagreedonanumberofissuesrelatingtothe

27agendaassetoutintheschedulingorderbytheCourt,and

28pursuanttothat,Iwouldseeitthefloor,withthepermission

29oftheCourt,withmylearnedfriendsontheotherside,because

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1Ibelieveweliterallyalmostagreedonit'sacommonposition

2inrespectofalltheissuesthatIhavejustsetouthere.So

3iftheCourtmaypermit,Iwillletmylearnedfriendonthe

4othersideaddresstheCourtinrespectoftheissuesarising.I

5amverygratefulforthetime.

6PRESIDINGJUDGE:Thankyou,MrGraham.Yes,well,wewill

7hearfromtheProsecution,then.

8MRAGHA:Yes,thankyou,YourHonour.Andindeedwehada

9veryusefulmeetingwiththeDefenceyesterday,wherebywetried

10toputforwardacommonpositiontowardsthisCourtthismorning

11sothattheCourt,ifitismindedtoagree,maypassordersby

12consent.Now,thefirstissueweaddressedwasnumberone,of

13course,whichisthelengthoffinaltrialbriefandallparties

14wanttofileafinaltrialbrief.Andintermsofthelengthof

15thefinaltrialbrief,wesoughtguidancefromtheCDFcase,and

16inthatcasetherewerefewerDefencewitnesses,bymorethan

17half.Ithinknorebuttalandcertainlylessemphasisonthe

18complexitiesoftheJCE,andinthatcasetheProsecutionhad

19beenallowedamaximumof400pagesincludingheaders,footnotes

20etcetera,andeachoftheDefencecounsel200pages.Sothe

21partiescametotheagreementthatfortheProsecution400pages,

22amaximumthereof,wouldalsobesufficient,andforeachDefence

23counsel,amaximumof200pages,andthiswaswhatweproposed

24jointlytoputforward.

25PRESIDINGJUDGE:Now,doItakethattomean,MrAgha,

26thattheProsecutionwillbesubmittingajointfinaltrialbrief

27inrelationtoallthreeaccused?Isthatright?Ratherthan

28separatetrialbriefs?

29MRAGHA:Well,thatwouldbethepreferablepositionaswe

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1didin98,wherebywehadthecommonlawbut,toadegree,dealt

2withthethreeaccused,butitwouldbeonebrief,thatisour

3proposal,uptoamaximumof400pages.

4PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Well,thatmakesitclear,

5then.TheProsecutionwillfollowguidelinesassetbytheCDF

6tofileamaximum400pagefinaltrialbriefandtheaccused,

7accordingtoyourunderstanding,MrAgha,willfilefinaltrial

8briefsuptoamaximumof200pages,assetoutinthepractice

9direction?

10MRAGHA:Yes,Iunderstandit'samaximumof200each,but

11itmaybe,andtheProsecutionwouldhavenoobjectionif,for

12example,thelegalpartwas,say,combinedandthattookmaybe

13300ofthepagesbutthenthebalancewassplitaccordingly,

14becauseitmaybethatoneofthebriefswillcontainallofthe

15legalarguments.

16PRESIDINGJUDGE:Well,thatsoundsreasonable,butthatis

17somethingweshouldreallyleavetotheDefence.Aslongasthey

18knowthattheirlimitationsare200pageseach.

19MRAGHA:Yes,YourHonour.Howtheychoosetosplititis

20forthem.

21PRESIDINGJUDGE:Yes,well,thatisveryhelpful.Thank

22you,MrAgha.

23MRAGHA:Andthesecondissuewasthedateforfilingof

24thefinaltrialbriefs.Now,welookedattheCDFcasewhich,as

25Ihaveindicated,hadfewerwitnesses,norebuttalandless

26emphasisontheJCEfactor.Andinthatcase,theCDFChamber

27initiallyallowedthreeweeksfromtheclosingoftheevidence.

28Andatthatstageitwasunclearwhetherthatwouldbeclosingof

29theentireevidence,shouldrebuttalbeallowed.

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1Inanyevent,thepartiesjointlyaskedthattheybe

2allowedsixweekstosubmittheirfinalbriefs,andtheCourt

3allowedthemfiveweeksintheevent.Andnorebuttalwas

4allowedinthatcasesoitwasfiveweeksafterthecloseofthe

5Defencecase.

6Now,thiscase,dependingontheCourt'sdecision,mayhave

7toputasmalleachpartyindeedwillhavetoputsomeperiod

8oftimeasideshouldtheCourtbemindedtograntrebuttalfor

9preparationofcrossexaminationorleadingthosewitnessesand

10thepartieswill,underthosecircumstances,andthefactthat

11perhapsourcasewasslightlylongerthantheCDFcase,thatwe

12wouldtakethecommongroundofrequestingsixweeksfromtoday

13wherebyfinaltrialbriefswillbesubmittedsimultaneouslyno

14laterthanFriday,8thofDecember.

15PRESIDINGJUDGE:That'snotwithstandingwhetherthereis

16rebuttalevidenceornot?

17MRAGHA:Yes,YourHonour.Webuiltinthefactorthat

18theremayormaynotbebutevenifthereisn'twefeelthatsix

19weeksisareasonabletime,bearinginmindthegreateramountof

20evidencewehavetoaddress,especiallyasintheDefencecase

21therewasmanyinsiderswhowerelaterbroughton.

22JUDGESEBUTINDE:Sorry,whatwasthatdateagain?

23MRAGHA:ItwassixweeksIbelievefromtoday,whichis

24Friday,the8thofDecember.

25PRESIDINGJUDGE:Yes,MrAgha.

26MRAGHA:Andwithaviewtoatleastwindingupthe

27evidenceinthecasebeforetherecess,thecommonpositionof

28thepartiesisthatwewouldallliketosubmitoralarguments

29andthesewouldperhapsbereservedforWednesday,the13th,and

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1ifneedbegoingonslightlyintothe14th,sothatthematter

2canactuallybecompletedbytherecess.

3PRESIDINGJUDGE:Well,thatbringsustothepoint.As

4youknow,theTrialChambercanlimitthelengthofthoseclosing

5arguments.DidyoudiscusswiththeDefencetheanticipated

6lengthofyourclosingargumentsandtheDefenceclosing

7arguments?

8MRAGHA:Yes.Ithinkbothsidesagreedthatitwasn't

9theplacetoreciteforhoursonendtheevidenceetcetera,and

10thatisbetterplacedinthefinaltrialbrief.Soagainwetook

11guidancefromtheCDFcase,andweweresuggestingamaximumof

12threehoursfortheProsecution,andamaximumoftwohourseach

13fortheDefence,subjectofcoursetotheTrialChamber'sability

14tolimitthattimeperiod,orthosetimeperiods,ifitfelt

15mindedtodoso.

16PRESIDINGJUDGE:Sowewouldbelookingatamaximumof

17ninehours.Thatwouldtake,fully,twohearingdays.

18MRAGHA:Well,inthatcase,YourHonour,thenperhapswe

19couldreduceitto,letussay,Prosecution,maybetwohours,and

20eachDefencecounsel,anhourandahalf,dependingonwhatmy

21learnedfriendswouldthink.

22PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Well,wewilldecidethat

23issuewhenwemakeourfinalorderonthematter.

24MRAGHA:Andthenfinally,lookingatpointnumberfive,

25whichisotherissuesrelatingtothiscase,oneofthemisof

26courserebuttalwhichYourHonourhasmentioned,andclearlythis

27applicationisstillpending,anditmayoritmaynotbegranted

28buttowhateverextentitmaybegranted,theProsecutionand

29Defencethoughtthatitwouldbeareasonableperiodoftimefor

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1theProsecutiontobringwhateverwitnessesitmaybeallowed

2betweentenand14daysofthatdecision,whichwouldallowthe

3Prosecutionsufficienttimetobringanyrebuttalwitnesseswho

4maybeoutofthecountry,andalsogivetheDefenceareasonable

5opportunitytoprepareforcrossexaminationofanyrebuttal

6witnesses,bearinginmindthatthescopeoftheirevidencewill

7belimited.So,thatisadecisionwhichisobviouslystillwith

8YourHonours.

9TheonlyotherissuewhichI'dliketoraiseistheissue

10whichlearnedcounsel,MrKnoops,raisedyesterdayandthatisin

11respectofwitnessTF1511.Now,thisisquiteaproblematic

12positioninthesensethatthereisanorderof24thNovember

132003wherebythiswitnesswasgivenglobalprotectivemeasures

14andat"K"ofthatdecision,essentiallythestartingpointis

15fortheDefencetoapproachtheCourtforamodification,ifyou

16like,ofthoseprotectivemeasuresandthen,iftheCourtwasso

17minded,fortheProsecutiontoassistinfindingthatwitness

18well,notfindingbutputtingtheDefenceincontactwiththat

19witness.Now,thepositionoftheProsecutionis,anditmaybe

20thattheCourtcouldvarytheseorderstoday,shouldtheDefence

21applytodoso,iswehavenodifficultyindisclosingthename

22ofthatwitnesstotheDefence.However,we'venotbeenin

23contactwiththatwitnessuntil2003.Aswe'veinformedthe

24Defencewedon'thavehiscontactdetails.SoiftheDefence

25weremindedtomakeanapplicationtoday,tovarythatprotective

26measuresorder,andallowit,theProsecutionwouldsuggestthat

27wecancertainlyprovidethenametotheDefence,and,inthose

28circumstances,theywouldbeatfulllibertytomakecontactwith

29thatperson,interviewhim,and,ifneedbe,iftheyfelthewas

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1required,makeanapplicationtocallhimasawitnessintheir

2case.

3Andunderthosecircumstances,theProsecutionfeelsthat

4wouldbethemostexpeditiouswayofdealingwiththematter

5becauseevenifthefirstlimboftheCourtvaryingthe

6protectivemeasurewasgranted,theProsecutionwouldnotbeina

7particularpositiontoactuallyfindorlocatethiswitness.

8Thosearethesubmissions,YourHonour.

9PRESIDINGJUDGE:Yes,thankyou,MrAgha.Now,I

10understandthatmostofwhatMrAghasaidisbyconsent,asfar

11astheDefenceisconcerned,butgoahead,MrManlySpain.You

12wereabouttosaysomething?

13MRMANLYSPAIN:Yes,YourHonours.It'sonlyaboutthe

14witnessTF1511.Weappreciatethesuggestionsmadebylearned

15counselwithregardtothiswitnessbutwewereoftheopinion

16thattogothroughthatwoulddelaythetrialandtheproceedings

17andthataneasywayoutisbyanapplicationunderRule92bis

18forthestatementofthewitnesstobetenderedinevidence,and

19thatcanbedealtwithtodayandthematterisoverwith.

20PRESIDINGJUDGE:Well,haveyoudiscussedthatwiththe

21Prosecution?

22MRMANLYSPAIN:Yes,YourHonour.Wesuggestedthatto

23theProsecutionbyemailandthereplyisthattheywouldbe

24objectingtothatapplication.Thoughwedonotwishtoprolong

25thismatterandIbelievethatIcanmaketheapplicationatthis

26momentanditisdealtwith,sothatwhenweleaveheretodaywe

27willknowwhatwearecomingfor.Wedon'twanttohavethis

28matterhanging.

29PRESIDINGJUDGE:Well,it'sRule92bis(C)saysthata

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1partywishingtosubmitinformationasevidenceshallgiveten

2days'noticetotheopposingparty.Isupposeyouwouldbe

3sayingthatthatnoticeisredundantinthesecircumstancessince

4itwastheopposingpartywhogaveyouthestatementinthefirst

5place?

6MRMANLYSPAIN:Ithinkmylearnedfriendshouldbe

7magnanimousandallowthisapplicationtobemade,sincethey

8gaveusthisinformationtwodaysago.Ithinkso.

9PRESIDINGJUDGE:Whatisyourattitudethen,MrAgha?

10MRAGHA:YourHonour,theattitudeoftheProsecutionis

11whenitcomestothesekindoftimeframesheretheProsecution

12certainlycanbemagnanimousbutthemainobjectiontothe

13Prosecution,orfortheProsecution,forallowingthis

14applicationof92bisisthattheevidenceisfromawitnesswho

15isofquitesomestanding.Itwasjustatranscripttakenfrom

16himin2003anditiscertainlyawitnesswhichtheProsecution

17wouldrely,wellwouldrequireandwouldneedandrequest

18crossexaminationof.Soevenifthestatementweretendered

19under92bistheproblemofthecrossexaminationofthatwitness

20wouldstillariseandasa92biswouldbetenderedbythe

21Defence,theProsecutionwouldsubmitthatitwouldbeforthe

22Defencetomakethatwitnessavailabletousfor

23crossexamination.Soit'sreallyonthosegroundsthatthe

24objectionwouldbemade.

25PRESIDINGJUDGE:Whenyousayatranscript,wasitaCourt

26proceedingorsomeothertypeoftranscript?

27MRAGHA:Myunderstandingisthatthegentlemanconcerned

28wasinterviewedbyinvestigatorsandthereweretapedinterviews

29andtheyweretranscribedanditisactuallythetranscriptof

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1thoseinterviewsratherthananywrittenstatementwhichweare

2discussinghere.

3PRESIDINGJUDGE:Iunderstand.

4JUDGESEBUTINDE:MrAgha,wehadanopportunitytolookat

5theredactedstatement,Ithink,thatwasexchangedbetween

6yourselves.Itappearstomeasifthisinterviewwasan

7interviewwiththemedia.Areyousureitwasaninterviewwith

8investigators?

9MRAGHA:Myunderstandingisitwasaninterviewcarried

10outbymembersatleastoftheofficeoftheProsecution,

11investigatorsIbelieve,oftheparticularwitness.Thatisat

12leastmyunderstanding.

13PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.MrManlySpain?

14MRMANLYSPAIN:Yes,YourHonour.

15PRESIDINGJUDGE:WetakeitthatyouareinopenCourt

16makinganapplicationunderRule92bisfortheadmissionofthis

17statement?

18MRMANLYSPAIN:Yes,YourHonour.

19PRESIDINGJUDGE:Didyouhaveanyfurthersubmissionsto

20supportyourapplication?

21MRMANLYSPAIN:Yes,YourHonour.Havingreadthe

22statement,webelievethatthiswitnesshasinhisstatement

23evidencethatgoestotherelevantevidencethatgoesto,that

24gotothechargesbeforetheCourt,particularlyonthematters

25ofjointcriminalenterprise,andalsothematterofthe

26cooperationbetweentheRUFandtheAFRC,andtheplanningof

27operations.Wealsobelievethattheinformationcontainedin

28thestatementisexculpatoryinrespectoftheaccusedpersons.

29ThatitwillassisttheDefenceoftheaccusedpersons.Wedo

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1notbelieve,andIrespectfullysubmitthattheProsecutionwould

2notbeprejudicedinanyrespectbythecontentsofthis

3statement.Moreover,YourHonours,ifweareassureditisnot

4thecasethatitisimperativethattheProsecutioncrossexamine

5thiswitness,havingregardtothefactthattheycameupwith

6thestatement,andwerekindenoughtopassitontous.With

7regardtotheprotectivemeasures,that,Ihaven'tseentheorder

8soitisdifficultformetomakeanapplicationforavariation

9ofthatorder,andtorequestthenameofthewitnessbut,the

10reasonbasicallyforourapplicationatthisstageistosavethe

11timeoftheCourt,andfortheproceedingstogoontoits

12conclusion,aswehavebeentryingtodo,andtryingtodetermine

13todayalthough,asIsaid,Idon'twantittothissmall

14mattertobehangingforustofixadatetocomeforthatet

15ceteraetceteraand,attheendoftheday,fromwhatmylearned

16friendtheProsecutionhassaid,itispossiblethatwemightnot

17evenbeabletogetincontactwiththiswitness.Thatisall,

18YourHonour.

19PRESIDINGJUDGE:Well,justoneotherthing.Asyouno

20doubtrealiseunderRule92bis(B),theTrialChambermustbe

21satisfiedthattheinformationitsreliabilityissusceptible

22toconfirmation.Whatdoyousayonthataspect?

23MRMANLYSPAIN:Well,fromwhatIhaveseen,YourHonour,

24andfromwhathastranspiredinthisCourt,werespectfully

25submitthatthisisreallyanauthenticdocumentfromthe

26Prosecution.AndIdonotbelievethatthematterofveracityis

27anissueatthisstage.Itisafterthedocumentistendered

28thattheCourtcanandwill,Iamsure,lookatthevalueofits

29contents.Thatisall.

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1PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Thankyou,MrManlySpain.

2Whatdoyouwishtoreply,MrAgha?

3MRAGHA:Yes,YourHonour.Aswe'vementioned,the

4questionobviouslyofthenoticeperiodisn'tthereatanyrate,

5asrequiredbytherules.Wecometothequestionof92bisand

6thepositionoftheProsecutionisthat,andIbelievehasbeen

7thecasesofar,isthatallwitnesseshavebeensubjectto

8crossexamination,iftheywere92bis,inorderthatthat

9evidencemaybetested.Wethinkthereisrelevantevidencein

10thattranscript,hencetheDefencewouldnotbewantingtotender

11itthrough92bis.AndIthinkanimportantpointwhichYour

12Honourshaveraised,andthatis92bis(B),isthatthe

13informationsubmittedmaybereceivedinevidenceif,andthisis

14aprecondition,intheviewoftheTrialChamber,itisrelevant

15tothepurposeforwhichitissubmittedandifreliabilityis

16susceptibletoconfirmation.

17NowIhavebeeninformedthatthistranscriptisnot

18reliableandthewitnesswhogaveitwasnotregardedasbeing

19reliableatthetimeandthatisonereasonwhy,althoughhewas

20putoninitialprotectivemeasurein2003,therewasno

21followupstothatbecause,underthecircumstances,weformed

22ourownopinionthathewasnotatruthfulwitnesswhowemay

23wanttoputbeforethisCourt.

24Now,Idon'thavetheexactdetailsastowhyhewasdeemed

25tobeunreliable,orwhathewassayingwasunreliablebut,ifwe

26wereabletohavehalfanhouradjournmentthenIcouldbring

27someonefromtheOTPwhocouldgiveandexplainthecircumstances

28inwhichthattranscriptwastaken,andhelptheBenchinmaking

29aninformeddecisiononitsreliability.Andcertainlyoneof

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1thepointswhichIdidspeaktotheProsecutoryesterday,onthis

2issueofthestatement,isthatshouldanapplicationbemade

3thentheProsecutionshouldcertainlybeallowedtomake

4submissionsastowhyitwasdeemedtobeunreliableand

5thereforewouldnotbesubjecttoa92bisapplication.Andeven

6then,ifthathurdleweretobecrossed,wewouldstillrequire

7thewitnesstocomeforcrossexamination.

8PRESIDINGJUDGE:Yes.JustbeforeIconsultmy

9colleagues,there'sactuallythreestatements,aren'tthere?

10It'snotjusttheonetranscript.Inoticethreedifferent

11dates.Thereisthe12thofFebruary2003;the11thofFebruary

122003andthe11thofJanuary2003.Soit'sthreedifferent

13transcripts,isn'tit?

14MRAGHA:Yes,therewasaseriesoftranscriptswhichI

15believeweretakenfromthisgentlemanoveraperiodoftime.

16PRESIDINGJUDGE:Isee.Justpardonmeforonemoment.

17[TheBenchconferred]

18PRESIDINGJUDGE:Yes,allright,MrAgha.Wewouldlike

19tohearthatwitnessonthereliabilitybeingsusceptibleto

20confirmation.Wewilladjourninduecourseandyoucanmake

21yourarrangements.MrManlySpain,youmadetheapplication;did

22youwanttoreplytoanythingMrAghasaid?

23MRMANLYSPAIN:No,yourHonour,everythinghasbeensaid.

24PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Ifwecanjustmoveontothe

25otherthingsthattheProsecutionsaid,gettingbacktosaythe

26lengthoftheDefencefinaltrialbriefs,it'sbeenagreed,

27accordingtoMrAgha,thatthemaximumfinaltrialbriefforeach

28accusedwillbe200pages;isthatcorrect?Thereisnoissues

29thereatall?

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1MRGRAHAM:Thatisso,YourHonours.

2PRESIDINGJUDGE:Andalsothedatesagreedbytheparties

3arenotnecessarilyagreedbytheCourt,butthedatesthatare

4thesubjectofamutualagreementarethatthefinaltrialbriefs

5wouldbesubmittednotlaterthanFriday,8thofDecember,and

6theclosingargumentstobedeliveredstartingWednesday,the

713th,andpossiblygoingoverintothe14thofDecember;isthat

8bycommonagreementaswell?

9MRGRAHAM:Iconfirmthatisso,YourHonours.

10PRESIDINGJUDGE:Andatthisstagetheagreementastothe

11lengthoftheclosingargumentswasthreehoursforthe

12ProsecutionandtwohourseachmaximumfortheDefence;isthat

13yourunderstanding,MrGraham?

14MRGRAHAM:Thatisalsothecase,YourHonour.

15PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Thankyou.Justtoremove

16anydoubtatallasregardstotheDefenceintentions,we've

17mentionedthatit'sbeenagreedthatthefinaltrialbriefswill

18be200pagesmaximumforeachaccused.Now,wewanttomakeit

19clearthatourunderstandingofthat,MrGraham,isthatit'sup

20totheDefenceastohowthose200pageseach,totalmaximum600

21pages,isdivided,aslongaswhateverthelegalargumentsand

22factualargumentsare,thatarepresentedinthosefinaltrial

23briefs,isconfinedtothattotalof200pageseach;havewegot

24thatcorrect?

25MRGRAHAM:Yes,YourHonour,thatwastheconsensusasof

26yesterday.Thatisthecase.

27PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Therewillbenoextrapages

28allowedforanyotherpurpose,whetherit'sforextralegal

29argumentorextrafactualpresentation.

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1MRGRAHAM:Thatisourunderstanding,YourHonour.

2PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Thankyou.

3JUDGEDOHERTY:MrManlySpain,thereisamatterIwishto

4clarify,arisingfromtheexpertreportonchildsoldiersbyMr

5Gbla,whichthetimemaypermityoutoclarify.Thefirstaspect

6isonpage23ofthereport,paragraph51.Onmycopythereisa

7referencetoafootnote43andIhavenofootnote43.

8MRMANLYSPAIN:Yes,thatisindeedthecase.Wewill

9fileacorrigendumtothattocorrectit.

10JUDGEDOHERTY:Andmysecondpoint,MrManlySpain,isa

11factualpointarisingoutofparagraph32.Andinittheexpert

12witnesssays:"ThegovernmentofSierraLeonesignedand

13ratifiedtheUNconventionontherightsofthechildof1989in

142000."IhadunderstoodthatSierraLeonehadsignedthe

15conventionontherightsofthechildin1989.Infact,itwas

16oneofthefirsttencountriestosignit.Sotheprotocolof

172000isadifferentissueandIwouldbegratefulifyoucould

18clarifythat.

19MRMANLYSPAIN:Yes,YourHonour.Wewilllookatthat.

20Iamnotsurefrommyrecollectionisthatafterthesigning

21thereneedstobeprocessinparliamenttoratifyit.

22JUDGEDOHERTY:That'scorrect.ThatiswhyIjustused

23thewordIlimitmywordto"signing."

24MRMANLYSPAIN:Yes.

25JUDGEDOHERTY:BecauseI'mawareithasn'tbeenadopted

26intodomesticlaw.

27MRMANLYSPAIN:Wewillclarifythat,YourHonour.

28JUDGEDOHERTY:Thankyou.

29MRMANLYSPAIN:Wehavenotedit.Thankyou,YourHonour.

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1PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Well,look,Ithinkthatwe

2aregoingtoadjournnowbutIthinkwe'vecoveredallthe

3mattersfixedintheagendafortoday.Isthereanyothermatter

4thatweshouldhaveconsideredbeforeweadjourn?

5MRGRAHAM:CertainlynotfromtheDefence.

6PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Thankyou,MrGraham.

7MRAGHA:Onlyjusttoclarify,YourHonour,ifyouwould

8liketohearfromsomeonefromtheProsecution,itwouldn't

9necessarilymeanthatsomeonetherewhowasawitnessatthetime

10butsomeonewhoknowsthebackgroundanddetailsunderwhichthe

11transcriptwastakenbecauseitwasbackin2003.Or,

12alternatively,wecanprovideanaffidavittotheCourtora

13declaration,whicheverispreferable,intermsofits

14reliability.

15PRESIDINGJUDGE:Well,it'sprobablybetterifyoucan

16producesomeperson.Weareonlylookingatawitnesstoassist

17usunderourconsiderationofRule92bis(B)butit'sprobably

18betterifyoupresentvivavoceevidencebecausetheDefence

19mightwishtoaskafewquestionsaswell.

20MRAGHA:Certainly,YourHonour.Iwilltryandfind

21someonewhohasknowledgeofthisandthenhecancomeandspeak

22abouttheofficeoftheProsecutionandthatinterview.

23PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Hopefullythatwillprove

24possible.Ifnotwewillconsiderotherformofevidencesuchas

25adeclaration.

26MRAGHA:IshalllookintothisandlettheCourt

27attendantknowassoonaspossible,Chamber'sassistant,sorry.

28PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Thankyou.Well,

29halfanhouriswhatyouareaskingfor,MrAgha;isthat

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1correct?

2MRAGHA:Yes.Ifwecouldperhapsadjournuntilhalfpast

3ten,thatshouldgivemesufficienttimetoseeifIcanfind

4someonewhohasmoredetailaboutthismatterbecauseobviously

5theyweren'texpectingthisissuetoarisetodayintheCourt.

6PRESIDINGJUDGE:Isee.Okay.Allright.Wewill

7adjourntheCourtthenuntil10.30.

8[Breaktakenat9.55a.m.]

9[AFRC27OCT06BMD]

10[Uponresumingat10.35a.m.]

11PRESIDINGJUDGE:Yes,MrAgha.

12MRAGHA:Yes,YourHonour.UndershortnoticeIwasable

13tofindagentlemanwhodoeshaveknowledgearoundthe

14circumstancesoftheseinterviews.Now,Ibroughtheishere

15sittinginthecourtroom.Now,dependingonhowYourHonour

16choosestoproceed,hecantakethewitnessboxandbeswornand

17youmayquestionhimoryoumayfeelthatIshouldleadhimon

18theseissuesandbesubjecttocrossexaminationbutIleavethat

19inyourhandshowyouchoosetoproceed.

20PRESIDINGJUDGE:Well,Ithinkthebestwaytoproceedis

21wewillhavehimgiveswornevidenceandyoucanleadhimon

22whereverareasthatyouwish,but,bearinginmindthathewas

23calledtogiveevidencetoassistus,inascertainingwhetherthe

24proposedevidenceunderRule92bisissusceptibleof

25confirmation,thatisthereasonyouarebringinghimhere.So,

26withthatqualification,that'sthebestwaytoproceed,MrAgha.

27MRAGHA:Yes,Iwouldagree,andIwouldcertainlylimit

28myquestionstothetranscriptandhopethatthe

29crossexaminationcouldalsobelimitedratherthantakemany

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1manyhours.

2PRESIDINGJUDGE:Yes.

3JUDGESEBUTINDE:MrAgha,justtoremindyou,Iamsure

4youareobviouslyawareofthisbutthereisafinelinebetween

5argumentspertainingtosusceptibilityofconfirmationandto

6reliability.Wewerejusthopingthatyouwon'tcrossthatline.

7MRAGHA:Iwilltrynotto,YourHonour,andIamsureyou

8willpullmeupshouldIdoso.

9JUDGEDOHERTY:MrAgha,youappeartohaveanothermember

10withyouandwehavenoappearance.

11MRAGHA:Iapologisefortheomission.It'sMsLeigh

12Lawrieandshewillbejoiningustoassistusonthisone

13confinedissue.

14PRESIDINGJUDGE:Isee.Allright.Thankyou.Forthe

15record,thewitnesstogiveevidencenowisbeingcalledin

16connectionwithanapplicationbytheDefencetotendera

17documentunderRule92bis.Thepurposeofhearingtheevidence

18ofthiswitnessistoassisttheTrialChambertoassesspursuant

19toRule92bis(B)whetherthedocument,andtheinformation

20containedtherein,hasareliabilitywhichissusceptibleof

21confirmation.Goahead,MrAgha,andcallyourwitness.

22MRAGHA:Yes.TheProsecutionwouldcallMrGilbert

23Morissetteandifhecouldbesworn.

24WITNESS:GILBERTMORISSETTE[Sworn]

25EXAMINEDBYMRAGHA:

26Q.So,witness,I'mgoingtoaskyouafewquestionsthis

27morning

28PRESIDINGJUDGE:Justfortherecord,hisnameandhis

29position.

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1MRAGHA:

2Q.Iwillstartwithsomebasicdetails.Sojustforthe

3record,whatisyourname?

4A.MynameisGilbertMorissette.

5Q.Whatisyourcurrentposition?

6A.IamthechiefofinvestigationfortheOfficeofthe

7Prosecutor.

8Q.Androughlywhendidyoustartworkingforthe

9investigationsdepartment?

10A.IstartedtheOTPinOctoberof2002.

11Q.Andyouwereworkingintheinvestigationsdivision;is

12thatright?Atthattime?

13A.AtthattimeIwasworkingintheinvestigationdivisionas

14thedeputychiefofinvestigation.

15Q.Andareyouawareofawitnesswhoisreferredto,and

16pleasedon'tnamehim,asTF1511?

17A.Yes,Iam.

18Q.Now,areyouawarethatthiswitnesswasinterviewedby

19membersoftheinvestigationsectionoftheofficeofthe

20ProsecutioninJanuaryandFebruary2003?

21A.Yes,Iam.

22Q.Doyouknowwhoconductedtheseinterviews?

23A.Itwasconductedbythethenchiefofinvestigation,

24DrAlanWhite.

25Q.Anddidyoucometolearnthattherewereanydifficulties

26regardingthewaytheseinterviewsweretranscribedorotherwise

27taken?

28A.Yes.

29Q.AndcanyoupleasetelltheCourt?

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1A.Duringthefirstinterview,inJanuary,thequalityofthe

2transcriptionofthetapethemselveswasextremely,extremely

3bad,tothepointthatafterseveralweeksofthe,ourtypistand

4courtreportersandstenographertryingtotranscribethose

5tapes,thatwe,DrWhitedecidedtosendthetapetotheFBI

6laboratory,intheState,inordertohavetotrytohavethe

7qualityofthetapeenhanced.Itcamebacksamething.They

8wereunabletodoanythingwithit.Sothequalitywassobad

9thatIwouldsay,Idon'tknowroughly,Ithinkprobably80per

10centor90percentofitwasnotwasnevertranscribedand

11whateverwastranscribedwasmostlyguessworkdoneonourpartso

12thatweputeverythingaside.

13Q.So,afterthat,wasthiswitnessagainreinterviewedto

14seeifyoucouldgetabetterinterview?

15A.Yes,wedid.Again,itwasconductedbyDrAlanWhiteand

16atthistimehebroughtwithhimacourtreportersothatthe

17transcriptcouldbemadeliveastheinterviewwasbeing

18conducted.Butagain,thequalityofthe,notthequalityofthe

19recordingatthistime,butoftheaccentorthespeakingofthe

20witnesswassobadthateventhecourtreporter,aftercoming

21backandafterrelisteningtothetapeandtryingandtryingfor

22weeksand,youknow,almostcommitted,youknow,breakdownon

23tryingtogetthesetranscriptsdone,thatfinally,youknow,we

24didwhatwecouldandeverythingwasputaside.

25Q.Nowyouwerenotpersonallypresentattheseinterviews,

26wereyou?

27A.No.

28Q.Now,didMrWhitespeaktoyouabouthisinterviewswith

29witnessTF1511?

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1A.Yes,hedid.

2Q.Andwhatdidhetellyouabouthisimpressionsofwitness

3TF1511?

4A.Basicallythatthewitnesswastotallyunreliable.That

5thewitnesswas

6PRESIDINGJUDGE:Justamomentplease,MrWitness.There

7isanobjection.

8MRMANLYSPAIN:Werespectfullyobjecttothisquestion

9becauseIdon'tbelievethatiswhatweareherefor.Wehaveto

10seewhetherthetapesortherecordingsofthetranscriptswere

11authentic,notwhetherthestatementgavetruestatementsor

12truefactsinthestatement.Wearenotgoingtothestatements

13themselves.

14PRESIDINGJUDGE:Yes,reliabilityisnotaprecondition

15ofadmissionunderRule92bis,MrAgha.SoIwillletyoureply

16tothatobjectionifyoulikebeforeweruleonit.

17MRAGHA:Well,YourHonour,areadingof92bisisifit's

18relevantanditsreliabilityissusceptibleforconfirmation.So

19inthatrespectIagreewithmylearnedfriendandIwilljust

20sticktothesubstance.

21Q.Now,didyoureadanypartofthesetranscripts?

22A.Alittlebit.Verylimited,though.

23Q.Andhowdidyouregardthem?

24A.Thatthewitnesswasbasicallythewitnesswasjust

25lyingandlookingafterhisowninterest.

26MRAGHA:It'sokay.Ifwecanjustscratchthat.

27Q.Iamnotreallyaskingthefactthatheislyingorlooking

28afterhisowninterest.Imean,howdidyoufindtheminterms

29oftheirreadability?

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1A.Well,thepartthatwecouldreadwecouldreadbutthen

2mostofitwasjustcouldnotbereallyreadorcouldnotbe

3couldnotmakeanysense.

4Q.Okay.Ihavenofurtherquestionsofthiswitness.

5PRESIDINGJUDGE:Thankyou.Yes,MrManlySpain.

6MRMANLYSPAIN:Justafewquestions.

7CROSSEXAMINEDBYMRMANLYSPAIN:

8Q.MrWitness,areyouconversantwiththerulesoftheCourt,

9thisCourt,regardingtheinvestigationandthetakingof

10statementsfromwitnesses?

11A.Yes,Iam.

12Q.Areyouawarewhetherthoseruleswerefollowedby

13MrWhite?

14A.Tomyknowledge,Iwasn'ttherebut,tomyknowledge,yes.

15MRMANLYSPAIN:Nomorequestions.

16PRESIDINGJUDGE:Anythingarisingfromthat?

17MRAGHA:No,YourHonour.

18QUESTIONEDBYTHECOURT:

19PRESIDINGJUDGE:

20Q.MrWitness,onethingIdon'tunderstandisthatwhen

21MrWhitearrangedforthiswitnesstobeinterviewed,inthe

22presenceofacourtreporter,whatexactlywastheproblemthen

23ofgettingdownonpaperwhatthewitnesssaid?

24A.Thewaythewitnesswasspeaking,YourHonour.

25Q.Andwhatwaywasthat?

26A.Very,verybadaccentandverybadpronunciation.Almost

27impossibletomakeoutwhatthewitnesswassaying.

28Q.Doyouknowwhatlanguagethewitnesswasinterviewedin?

29A.InEnglish,YourHonour.

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1Q.Andisthatthemothertongueofthiswitness?

2A.No,YourHonour.

3Q.Didtheytakealonganinterpreter?

4A.No,YourHonour.

5Q.Doyouknowwhythatwas?

6A.No.

7JUDGESEBUTINDE:

8Q.So,doyoureckonthatifthiswitnessweretospeakinhis

9ownlanguage,withtheassistanceofaninterpreter,perhapsa

10betterjobcouldhavebeendone?

11A.Idon'tknow.Iwasn'tthere.

12Q.So,inotherwords,theonlyproblemwiththesetapesand

13transcriptionwasbecauseofthewitness'saccentandthefact

14thatthetranscriberscannotunderstandthataccent?

15A.That'scorrect.

16PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Thankyou.

17MRAGHA:MayIjustask,bringtotheBench'sattentiona

18followuparisingfromlearnedJusticeSebutinde'squestions?In

19thetranscriptoftheinterview,andIwon'tobviouslygivethe

20name,oneofthequestionsis,andthisisonpage00020059is:

21"Okay,youhavementionedtomethatyouspeak

22manylanguagesoneofwhichisEnglish;isthat

23correct?

24"A.IspeakEnglish,French,ArabicandI

25speakFullah,Wolof,Sush,Ibelieve,the

26Africanlanguages,thelanguagewithFrenchand

27Arabic."

28Sothewitnesshimself,andthenwegoon:

29"Now,thelanguagethatwewilluseforthis

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1interviewwhichIbelieveyoumentionedtoyou

2isthelanguageoftheSpecialCourtisEnglish

3andyouunderstandEnglishandcanyouspeak

4Englishenough?

5"A.IcanspeakEnglishenough."

6So,sofarasthewitnesswasconcerned,hefelt

7comfortablecarryingouttheinterviewintheEnglishlanguage.

8PRESIDINGJUDGE:Whatpageisthatagain?Forgetthe

9Court,forgettheRegistrypage.

10MRAGHA:Thispageisn'tbeforetheCourt,YourHonour,

11becausewegavetheRule68excerptsoftheinterviewofthis

12witness.

13PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Butasfarasthe

14investigatorswereconcerned,thewitnesshadstatedthathe

15speaksEnglishwellenoughtobeinterviewedinEnglish.

16MRAGHA:Yes,andthatiswhathechosetodo.SoI

17suspectthatiswhyaninterpreterwasn'tcalled.

18JUDGESEBUTINDE:But,MrAgha,thepreferencewasthe

19interviewer'spreference.Englishwasthelanguagethatthe

20investigatorpreferredandaccordingtowhatyou'vereadthe

21witnessjustwentalongwiththatbecausetherewasno

22interpreter.It'sdifferentwhenthechoiceisgiventothe

23witnessandhesays"Iprefertheinterviewbeconductedin

24Arabic"andthenyouhaveaproblembecauseyouhaveno

25interpreter.Fromtheexcerptyou'vereaditappearstomethat

26Englishwasnotthepreferredlanguagebutthatthewitnesswent

27alongwithitandsaid"Well,Iamcomfortable.Ispeaksome.

28IfyouaregoingtounderstandtheEnglishIspeakfine."It

29seemstomethat'swhathappened.

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1MRAGHA:Yes,thatwouldbethecase,YourHonour.

2PRESIDINGJUDGE:MrManlySpain,anythingarisingfrom

3whattheBenchaskedthewitness?

4MRMANLYSPAIN:Mineisnotreallyaquestionforthe

5witness.It'sreallyapointofobservation.Thatwhatwehave

6beforeus,wecanread,andtheevidencethatthewitnesshas

7givenisthatthisstatementisauthentic.

8PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Ithinkwecanletthe

9witnessgoinanyevent.

10MRMANLYSPAIN:Yes.

11PRESIDINGJUDGE:MrWitness,thankyouforgiving

12evidence.YouarefreetoleavetheCourtnow.

13THEWITNESS:Thankyou.

14[Thewitnesswithdrew]

15PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Well,MrManlySpain,wewill

16hearanyfurthersubmissionsyouwishtomakeinregardtothe

17testimonywe'vejustheard.

18MRMANLYSPAIN:YourHonour,mysubmissionisbriefthat

19fromthetestimonywehavejusthad,itisclearthattherules

20werefollowedinobtainingthisstatementthathasbeenservedon

21us.Therefore,Isubmitthatthestatementisauthentic.We

22haveitbeforeus.Wecanreadit.Whathasnotbeen,what

23areashavenotbeenredactedIrespectfullywouldsubmitthat

24thisstatementhasbeenconfirmedasauthenticbythewitness,

25andthatit'snowamatterfortheCourttodecide,ifadmitted

26weighttobegiventoit,andIrespectfullyamsubmittingthat

27itshouldbeadmittedbecauseofitsrelevanceandtheother

28pointsIraisedearliertoday.Thatisall,YourHonour.

29PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Thankyou.Didyouwantto

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1reply,MrAgha?

2MRAGHA:Yes,verybriefly.Undertheruleit'sa

3questionofreliabilitynotauthenticity,anditistheviewof

4theProsecutionthatthesetranscripts,reliabilityisnot

5subjecttosusceptibletoconfirmation,aspertherequirements

6oftheruleand,furthermore,ifintheopinionofYourHonours

7indeeditisadmissibleunderthisrule,becauseofthenatureof

8theevidenceandthefactthattheredoesseemtobeadisputeas

9toitsreliability,thattheProsecutionbeallowedto

10crossexaminethiswitnesstoindeedtestitsreliabilityinopen

11Court.

12PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Thankyou.

13JUDGESEBUTINDE:MrAgha,Ihaven'tunderstood.Youjust

14saidthedocumentisn'tsusceptibletoconfirmationbutyou

15haven'tsaidhoworwhy;whydoyousayso?

16MRAGHA:Isayit'snotsusceptibletoconfirmationbased

17onreliabilityandtherulesaysitsreliabilityissusceptible

18ofconfirmation.Now,mysubmissionisthatititselfmaybe

19susceptibleofbeingofvalueofanysorts,butit'sreliability

20isnotsusceptibleofconfirmationdue,forexample,the

21difficultiesthatweretakenintranscribingit,thelanguage

22issues,thefactthatitmayhavebeenthatthewitnessshould

23havebeengiventheoptiontospeakinhisfirstlanguageand

24wasn'tgiventheoption,rightlyorwrongly.Thefactthatit

25hadtobetakendowninalanguagewhichhemayhavebeennot

26veryfamiliarwithandnotverykeentoshowthathelackedthat

27familiarity.So,intermsofitsownreliability,he,inhis

28maybelessthanperfectEnglish,mayhavebeensayingwordsor

29thingswhichhedidn'tmeantosay.Sointhatregardbecauseof

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1thetranscriptionalproblemsandthelanguageproblemsinthe

2submissionoftheProsecutionitsreliabilityisnotsusceptible

3ofconfirmation.

4[TheBenchconferred]

5PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Well,look,wewillconsider

6thesubmissions.Wewilladjournfornow.Wewillresumeat12

7o'clock.Thatisonehourfromnow.

8[Breaktakenat11.00a.m.]

9[AFRC27OCT06CMD]

10[Uponresumingat12.15p.m.]

11PRESIDINGJUDGE:Wemakethefollowingordersinrespect

12oftheagendaitemsforthestatusconference.Weemphasisethat

13theseorderswillbeconfirmedbyaformaldecisioninwriting

14andnotonlyconfirmedbutpossiblyexpandedupon.

15Firstly,theorderswhichfollowarebyagreementbetween

16theparties:

17A.Thelengthofthefinaltrialbrieffiledonbehalfof

18eachaccusedshallnotexceed200pages.

19B.ThefinaltrialbrieffortheProsecutionshallbe

20filedasonedocumentnotexceeding400pages.

21C.Thefinaltrialbriefshallcomplyinallother

22respectsIwillbacktracktherethefinaltrialbriefs,in

23plural,shallcomplyinallotherrespectswiththepractice

24directiononfilingdocumentsbeforetheSpecialCourtforSierra

25Leone.

26D.TheclosingargumentsfortheProsecutionshallnot

27exceedthreehoursandforeachoftheaccusedshallnotexceed

28twohours.

29InrespectofthefollowingorderstheTrialChambernotes

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1thecommongroundestablishedbythepartiesbutnevertheless

2ordersasfollows:

31.ThefinaltrialbriefsfortheProsecutionandthe

4DefenceshallbefiledonorbeforeFriday,the1stofDecember

52006.

62.TheclosingargumentsoftheProsecutionandthe

7DefenceshallbepresentedonThursday,the7thofDecember2006

8withapossiblecarryovertoFriday,the8thofDecember.

9WeturnnowtothequestionofthetenderbytheDefenceof

10theinterviewtranscriptexcerptsofwitnessTF1511.The

11followingisthemajoritydecision.

12Rule92bisoftheRulesofProcedureandEvidenceprovides

13asfollows:

14A.AChambermayadmitasevidenceinwholeorinpart

15informationinlieuoforaltestimony.

16B.Theinformationsubmittedmaybereceivedinevidence

17if,intheviewoftheTrialChamber,itisrelevanttothe

18purposeforwhichitissubmittedandifitsreliabilityis

19susceptibleofconfirmation.

20C.Apartywishingtosubmitinformationasevidenceshall

21givetenday'snoticetotheopposingparty.Objections,ifany,

22maybesubmittedwithinfivedays.

23Asregardsthetenday'snoticeinRule92bis(C)wemake

24theobservationthatthedocumentswere,infact,inthe

25possessionoftheProsecutionsince2003andwasservedonthe

26Defenceonthe26thofOctober2006.Accordingly,pursuantto

27Rule54wedispensewiththetenday'snoticerequirement.

28WithreferencetoRule92bis(B)weareoftheviewthatthe

29informationinthesaiddocumentsisrelevant.Wemustfollow

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1theinterpretationplacedonRule92bisbytheAppealsChamberin

2thecaseofProsecutionvFofanaetal,SCSL0414AR73,decision

3onappealagainstdecisiononProsecution'smotionforjudicial

4noticeandadmissionofevidence,datedthe16thofMay2005at

5paragraph26.TheAppealsChamberdecisiongivesthefollowing

6interpretationofRule92bisandwequote:

7"SCSLRule92bisisdifferenttotheequivalent

8RuleintheICTYandICTRanddeliberatelyso.

9ThejudgesofthisCourt,atoneoftheirfirst

10plenarymeetings,recognisedaneedtoamend

11ICTRRule92bisinordertosimplifythis

12provisionforacourtoperatinginwhatwas

13hopedwouldbeashorttimespaninthecountry

14wherethecrimeshadbeencommittedandwherea

15TruthandReconciliationCommissionandother

16authoritativebodiesweregeneratingtestimony

17andotherinformationabouttherecently

18concludedhostilities.TheeffectoftheSCSL

19Ruleistopermitthereceptionof

20'information'assertionsoffact(butnot

21opinion)madeindocumentsorelectronic

22communicationsifsuchfactsarerelevantand

23theirreliabilityis'susceptibleof

24confirmation.'Thisphraseologywaschosento

25makeclearthatproofofreliabilityisnota

26conditionofadmission:Allthatisrequired

27isthattheinformationshouldbecapableof

28corroborationinduecourse.Itisforthe

29trialchambertodecidewhethertheinformation

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1comesinaform,orisofakind,thatis

2'susceptibletoconfirmation'.Itfollows,of

3course,fromthefactthatitsreliabilityis

4'susceptibleofconfirmation',thatitisalso

5susceptibleofbeingdisproved,orsoseriously

6calledintoquestionthatthecourtwillplace

7norelianceuponit.Rule92bispermitsfacts

8whicharenotbeyonddisputetobepresentedto

9thecourtinawrittenorvisualformthatwill

10requireevaluationinduecourse.Theweight

11andreliabilityofsuch'information'admitted

12viaRule92biswillhavetobeassessedin

13lightofalltheevidenceinthecase."

14We'vealreadymadeafindingthatinourviewthe

15informationinthesaiddocumentsisrelevant.Wealsofindthat

16thesaidinformationcomesinaformorisofakindthatis

17susceptibletoconfirmation.Accordingly,werulethatthe

18interviewtranscriptsofwitnessTF1511fallwithinthestated

19criteriaforadmissibilityandwethereforeadmittheminto

20evidenceasExhibitD39.

21[ExhibitNo.D39wasadmitted]

22PRESIDINGJUDGE:Also,whenwesaythattheexcerpts,

23interviewtranscripts,areadmittedintoevidenceasExhibitD39

24wearereferringtotheunredactedtranscripts.

25MRMANLYSPAIN:Thankyou,YourHonour.

26PRESIDINGJUDGE:Now,inrelationtothosetranscripts

27beingadmittedintoevidence,wenotetheProsecutionadvicethat

28witnessTF1511iscoveredbyprotectivemeasuresand,toremove

29anydoubt,weconfirmthattheprotectivemeasuresorderedby

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1JusticeItoe,inhisdecisionofthe21stofNovember2003,

2entitled"DecisionontheProsecutionmotionforimmediate

3protectivemeasuresforwitnessesandvictims"shallbe

4applicabletowitnessTF1511or,rather,shallcontinuetobe

5applicabletowitnessTF1511.

6Well,Ithinkthatconcludesthisstatusconference.Any

7otherbusinessweshouldhaveaddressed?

8MRAGHA:Ijustwantedtoclarify,YourHonour,hasthat

9statementbeenadmittedsubjecttocrossexaminationorwithout

10crossexamination?

11PRESIDINGJUDGE:No,it'sadmittedunder92bisasitis

12withoutcrossexamination.

13MRAGHA:Thankyou,YourHonour.

14PRESIDINGJUDGE:Didyouhavethatunredactedstatement

15here,MrAgha?

16MRAGHA:Wedon'thaveitwithus,YourHonour,butwecan

17certainlyproduceit.

18PRESIDINGJUDGE:ProduceittoCourtManagement?

19MRAGHA:Yes.

20PRESIDINGJUDGE:Yes.Allright.Thankyou.

21JUDGESEBUTINDE:Andthatwouldbebeforethecloseof

22today,hopefully?

23MRAGHA:Yes,YourHonour.

24JUDGESEBUTINDE:Okay.

25PRESIDINGJUDGE:Allright.Well,ifthereisnoother

26businesswewilladjournnowuntilfurtherorderoftheCourt.

27[Whereuponthehearingadjournedat12.30p.m.,

28tobereconvenedonfurtherorderoftheCourt]

29

SCSLTRIALCHAMBERII

EXHIBITS:

ExhibitNo.D3930

WITNESSESFORTHEDEFENCE:

WITNESS:GILBERTMORISSETTE18

EXAMINEDBYMRAGHA18

CROSSEXAMINEDBYMRMANLYSPAIN22

QUESTIONEDBYTHECOURT22